🚀 go-pugleaf

Brenda Bass wrote:

: >     compact
: >     d i s c

: Uh, Dan... FWIW, my CD-ROM drive has no logo on it.  Nothing
: at all identifies it as a CD-ROM.  Does this mean I can
: start using it for a mug holder as well?

(Serious here)  It really doesn't?  Paging Terry Carroll!  I've seen
the logo that Dan mentioned on every -- well, I guess every -- CD player
or CD-ROM drive I've ever seen.  The distinctive logo ignores brand names,
et cetera.  If it chews on a CD, it has that logo on it.  I thought there 
was some legal connection between the hardware and the logo, like 
trademarking or something.

When are you allowed/required to display the distinctive logo?
When are you not forbidden/excused from displaying it?
Does Brenda just have a stealth CD-ROM drive?

Regards
Ray

h...@slc.unisys.com (Helge Moulding) writes:
| 
...
| In fact, I suspect that all technological innovations spawn legends. I 
| wouldn't be the least surprised to find that there are cave paintings 
| which include a story of the woman who thought fire was pretty, and 
| tried to hang some of it from a string around her neck...

Yea, women have known for *ages* that the proper way to
string fire around one's neck is to first capture it
in diamonds, emeralds, rubies or pearls.

:)

Hugh Ashton <hu...@nexustech.com> writes:
| 
| I once had the job of doing the preliminary testing and documentation of
| some utilities for a computer maker. When it said "Press any key to
| continue" I regularly annoyed the head of software by pressing the
| Shift, Alt, Caps Lock, Num Lock keys, etc. while he said "When it says
| any key, it doesn't really mean it." We (I?) changed the in-house
| standard to "Press the space bar to continue".

Some smart-alek did the same thing to me at my first
job out of high school -- funny, every one else seemed
to deal with it, but he *had* to be a twink. So I wandered
over to his terminal (an ADM-3A, of course) with a black
marker and wrote ANY on his space bar.

Then I changed the prompt to "Press the ANY key to continue"
if and only if running from his account ... and only accepted
the space bar. :) :)

> >     compact
> >     d i s c
>
> Uh, Dan... FWIW, my CD-ROM drive has no logo on it.

For another data point, neither does the Sun external CD-ROM I've got in front
of me here at work. In a quick walk-around of the office, it appears that
roughly 50% of the Sun internal CD-ROM drives have that logo visible on their
outsides.

-Bennett

In article <4vvrfv$l...@fcnews.fc.hp.com>, r...@fc.hp.com (Ray Depew) wrote:


> (Serious here)  It really doesn't?  Paging Terry Carroll!  I've seen
> the logo that Dan mentioned on every -- well, I guess every -- CD player
> or CD-ROM drive I've ever seen. 

A data point:  No internal Apple CD-ROM drive of which I'm aware 
(and I've worked with or owned most) bears any sort of distinctive
marking.  They're just flat, featureless gray drawers.

Randy Patton wrote:

> A data point:  No internal Apple CD-ROM drive of which I'm aware
> (and I've worked with or owned most) bears any sort of distinctive
> marking.  They're just flat, featureless gray drawers.

Actually, the drive unit has got a logo on it, but when you install it
internally there's a plastic thingy (can't remember what they're called)
that goes on the front of the drive bay. It's supposed to keep the front
of the computer smooth and consistant. So the logo is there, it's just
covered up.

Pete
-- 
The opinions expressed here are not those of anyone, including myself.
No gerbils were harmed in the making of this message. Your mileage may
vary.

In article <randy.patton-3...@news.vt.edu>,
randy....@vt.edu (Randy Patton) wrote:

> In article <4vvrfv$l...@fcnews.fc.hp.com>, r...@fc.hp.com (Ray Depew) wrote:
> 
> 
> > (Serious here)  It really doesn't?  Paging Terry Carroll!  I've seen
> > the logo that Dan mentioned on every -- well, I guess every -- CD player
> > or CD-ROM drive I've ever seen. 
> 
> A data point:  No internal Apple CD-ROM drive of which I'm aware 
> (and I've worked with or owned most) bears any sort of distinctive
> marking.  They're just flat, featureless gray drawers.

The operative word here might be "distinctive". I have an audio CD player
and two computer CD drives. The logo on the audio CD is easily discernible
(gold paint on a black background), but on one CD I had to look really
close to tell what the logo said (without looking closely it's just a
rough spot on the part of the tray that's visible when the door is closed,
unpainted).

I was about to report that my other computer CD did not have the logo, but
then I looked again very closely with a flashlight. It's there, but it's
VERY hard to see. It's actually easier to find with your fingers than with
your eyes.

Once found, all three logos are identical. I'm beginning to lean toward
the hypothesis suggested earlier - that it's a legal requirement of some
kind, or at least an "industry standard".

Those of you who have reported not seeing it on your drives, look again.
Very carefully. You might have overlooked it.

-Ron Hunsinger

r...@fc.hp.com (Ray Depew) writes:
> Brenda Bass wrote:
>
> : >	  compact
> : >	  d i s c
>
> : Uh, Dan... FWIW, my CD-ROM drive has no logo on it.  Nothing
> : at all identifies it as a CD-ROM.
>
> (Serious here)  It really doesn't?  Paging Terry Carroll!  I've seen
> the logo that Dan mentioned on every -- well, I guess every -- CD player
> or CD-ROM drive I've ever seen.  The distinctive logo ignores brand names,
> et cetera.  If it chews on a CD, it has that logo on it.  I thought there
> was some legal connection between the hardware and the logo, like
> trademarking or something.
>
> When are you allowed/required to display the distinctive logo?
> When are you not forbidden/excused from displaying it?
> Does Brenda just have a stealth CD-ROM drive?

"Compact disc" will be a Philips trade mark, as they invented CDs.
While the patents last every manufacturer in the world will have to pay
them a royalty and acknowledge them by showing the compact disc logo.

This was also true of "compact cassette" (the bog standard audio
cassette) which was also invented by Philips (the Dutch electronics
company). Until about 10 years ago, every audio cassette you bought
would have had their compact cassette logo printed on it.

-Shez.
________________________________________________________________________

 Xmas presents: "Make mine a CD scratcher, er, cleaner." [Stewart Dean]
________________________________________________________________________

In article <504bnn$6...@cloud9.net>
kenb...@cloud9.net (Kenneth Brody) writes:


> Because it wasn't a defective disk.  It was a data disk, and they were
> having problems with some function of the program with that data.  We asked
> for a copy of the disk, rather than the original, so they would still be
> able to run everything else.  What came in the mail was a Xerox(tm) copy
> of the diskette.

Also, I've recovered data from several 5 1/4 floppy disks for people. I
always started by requesting a copy of the disk created by doing a
track level copy (it's been awhile, so I might not have the term
right). This gives an image of all the data on the disk. In over 95% of
the disks I received the damage was to the pointers in the catalog,
which means that my copy had enough data to work with. I'd rebuild the
catalog on a byte level and retrieve the files. 
As to the idea of "stupid lusers", I don't buy it. Yes, I get problems
with users who refuse to read the manuals or follow instructions, but
that's fairly rare.  The majority of the problems in our school are
caused by incomplete and inaccurate instructions. When I install a new
service to our networks I know how it works. I know the ins and outs.
But I'm not a teacher. It's very difficult for me to pass on the
information in a useable way, and even more difficult to not
rationalize the problems by thinking "stupid luser",  but I'm working
on it.
I get to kill the rare ones that really are stupid, so that helps.

Bob Church

 > From: m...@cs.nott.ac.uk (Mike Knell)
 > Date: 21 Aug 1996 13:27:24 GMT

 > I don't think this has been discussed before in
alt.folklore.* --
 > if so, feel free to ignore me.

--8<------------------

 > Tech support person gets phone call from customer who says
that
 > "The cup holder on my PC is broken and I am within my
warranty

----------8<-------

 > I've seen this in the "funny stuff" page at the back of
virtually
 > every computer rag I've read over the last couple of months.
The

Welcome to the the place where many mags crib their stories. I
was going to say `welcome to the horse's mouth', but you're a
little way behind.

Terry

In article <4vvdb4$6...@lex.zippo.com> h...@slc.unisys.com (Helge Moulding)
writes:

| Consider some of the other stories.
| 
| * the photocopy of the disk - why would the service center want a *copy*
|   of a disk? If the disk is defective, they have you send it in for an
|   exchange.

Just because something has reached urban legend status, doesn't mean it hasn't
happened.  When I worked at Data General, we did have this happen (I talked to
the people involved, and saw the photocopy).  Basically the support center
wanted a copy of the TAPE (9 track, 1600 BPI), and the luser photo-copied the
tape, and sent it in.  However from the paper label on the tape, the support
center determined that they had the wrong tape.
-- 
Michael Meissner, Cygnus Support (East Coast)
955 Massachusetts Avenue, Cambridge, MA 02138, USA
meis...@cygnus.com,	617-354-5416 (office),	617-354-7161 (fax)

Shez wrote:

> "Compact disc" will be a Philips trade mark, as they invented CDs.
> While the patents last every manufacturer in the world will have to pay
> them a royalty and acknowledge them by showing the compact disc logo.

That's true, aside from the fact that Philips and Sony jointly
administer licensing (some of Sony's patents are also involved).  There
are several variations of the Compact Disc logo, to go with each of the
several applications for which CD has been adopted; CD-ROM drives carry
only the main logo, while audio CD players also have the words "DIGITAL
AUDIO" under the logo.  (I'm told that Philips and Sony used to require
the logo on disc labels and even on disc packaging, but I've seen a
number of discs lately that don't carry the logo so this may not be
enforced any more.)
 
> This was also true of "compact cassette" (the bog standard audio
> cassette) which was also invented by Philips (the Dutch electronics
> company). Until about 10 years ago, every audio cassette you bought
> would have had their compact cassette logo printed on it.

Not quite.  For one thing, Philips didn't coin that name or create that
logo until some time after the format was introduced.  (The first
cassette recorder was originally called the Pocket Recorder in Europe
and the Carry-Corder in the U.S.)  As best I can tell they never
demanded that logo on cassettes or machines, and I've seen many of both
from throughout the 1970s and 1980s (and some earlier) that did not
carry the Compact Cassette logo.

The first recording format I know of for which a specific logo was
mandated from the start was the "U" 3/4" video cassette system, in 1971.

tph@longhorn.uucp (Tom Harrington) writes:

> Ray Depew (r...@fc.hp.com) wrote:
>
> : I'm not sure where I live, but I'll ask anyway:  do you by any chance
> : cross the equator on your drive to work?
> 
> Oh, THAT'S RIGHT!  Hard drives and floppy drives spin the other way
> south of the equator!  A side-effect of this is that they can't be
> used *at* the equator, because they don't spin at all.  You've also
> got to watch out if you get one close to the poles, because the spin
> velocity increases toward infinity (that's why they're called "poles",
> because if you plot spin velocity vs. latitude, the plot has a 
> pole at +90 and -90 degrees).  Usually the drives break apart 
> before you get to the pole; if you ever got one all the way there,
> it would implode on itself and create a black hole.
> 
> I believe this is becuase of the Coriolis effect.

You wouldn't believe the peak transfer rates you get on disks in the
Yukon.

Disk units used in space use a full track buffer and special logic to
reverse the bits in the track buffer when in the hemisphere opposite the
one of launch.  It's why space-rated computers are so expensive.

-- 
Steve VanDevender         USENET haiku: Take it somewhere else
email: ste...@hexadecimal.uoregon.edu   This thread does not belong here
WWW: http://jcomm.uoregon.edu/~stevev   Death to crossposters

In article <87ybiq4...@tzadkiel.efn.org>, Steve VanDevender
<ste...@efn.org> wrote:

> tph@longhorn.uucp (Tom Harrington) writes:
> 
> > Oh, THAT'S RIGHT!  Hard drives and floppy drives spin the other way
> > south of the equator!  A side-effect of this is that they can't be
> 
> Disk units used in space use a full track buffer and special logic to
> reverse the bits in the track buffer when in the hemisphere opposite the
> one of launch.  It's why space-rated computers are so expensive.

But energy is abundant in a polar orbit. They connect the disk to a
generator charging a battery. When they fly over the pole, the output is
enormous. But they have to manually flip the connection before passing
over the other pole, or the generator would rapidly discharge the battery
instead.

And no, they can't use diodes for this, because all the equipment
connected to the system has to be coriolis-savvy or it won't work, and
coriolis-savvy diodes conduct in the opposite direction in the other
hemisphere.

-Ron Hunsinger

On Fri, 30 Aug 96 17:37:50  GMT, Shez <Sh...@sv.span.com> wrote:

>r...@fc.hp.com (Ray Depew) writes:
>> Brenda Bass wrote:
>>
>> : >	  compact
>> : >	  d i s c
>>
>> : Uh, Dan... FWIW, my CD-ROM drive has no logo on it.  Nothing
>> : at all identifies it as a CD-ROM.
>>
>> (Serious here)  It really doesn't?  Paging Terry Carroll!

You rang?

>>                                                              I've seen
>> the logo that Dan mentioned on every -- well, I guess every -- CD player
>> or CD-ROM drive I've ever seen.  The distinctive logo ignores brand names,
>> et cetera.  If it chews on a CD, it has that logo on it.  I thought there
>> was some legal connection between the hardware and the logo, like
>> trademarking or something.

It could be a trademark, or a ... damn, I can't remember the name, I think
it's "certification mark", to indicate that the device in question is
certified to meet the specifications specified by the owner of the
certification mark.

>"Compact disc" will be a Philips trade mark, as they invented CDs.

Trademark has nothing to do with inventorship.  Inventorship is a patent
concept.  One obtains a patent by inventing something, and completing a
patent application that specifies what is invented and claimed.  In the
U.S., one obtains a trademark (or service mark, or certification mark) by
using the mark in commerce to identify a good (or identify a service, or
identify compliance with the certification requirement).  In some
jurisdictions, a trademark is obtained by registration, rather than use.

(The above is a quick gloss -- there are exceptions and details I haven't
mentioned, but that's the basics.)

In the U.S., the sole link is that trademarks and patents are both
administered by the Patent and Trademark Office.

>While the patents last every manufacturer in the world will have to pay
>them a royalty and acknowledge them by showing the compact disc logo.

You may be on to something here, as the patent owner may require the use
of the logo as a condition of a license, but that's a matter of the
individual contract, and not a matter of law in the absence of such a
contract.

Generally, a patent owner will require the licensee to mark the product,
but not with some distinctive logo, which give no legal advantage
(although it may have some marketing elan).  The usual marking requirement
is for the licensee to mark with the patent number.   Failing to mark can
significantly reduce damages.

FWIW, I'm looking at my Sony CDR-93, and don't see any patent marking.
 
--
Terry Carroll       | "In a professional sports league game played in the
Santa Clara, CA     | United States, the head referee ... shall ... in the
car...@tjc.com     | event of conflicting calls, review instant replay to
Modell delenda est  | determine the correct call." - House Bill H.R. 3096

bass...@usit.net wrote:
> 
> hns...@sirius.com (Ron Hunsinger) wrote:
> 
> >In article <randy.patton-3...@news.vt.edu>,
> >randy....@vt.edu (Randy Patton) wrote:
> 
> >> In article <4vvrfv$l...@fcnews.fc.hp.com>, r...@fc.hp.com (Ray Depew) wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> > (Serious here)  It really doesn't?  Paging Terry Carroll!  I've seen
> >> > the logo that Dan mentioned on every -- well, I guess every -- CD player
> >> > or CD-ROM drive I've ever seen.
> >>
> >> A data point:  No internal Apple CD-ROM drive of which I'm aware
> >> (and I've worked with or owned most) bears any sort of distinctive
> >> marking.  They're just flat, featureless gray drawers.
> 
> >The operative word here might be "distinctive". I have an audio CD player
> >and two computer CD drives. The logo on the audio CD is easily discernible
> >(gold paint on a black background), but on one CD I had to look really
> >close to tell what the logo said (without looking closely it's just a
> >rough spot on the part of the tray that's visible when the door is closed,
> >unpainted).
> 
> >I was about to report that my other computer CD did not have the logo, but
> >then I looked again very closely with a flashlight. It's there, but it's
> >VERY hard to see. It's actually easier to find with your fingers than with
> >your eyes.
> 
> >Once found, all three logos are identical. I'm beginning to lean toward
> >the hypothesis suggested earlier - that it's a legal requirement of some
> >kind, or at least an "industry standard".
> 
> >Those of you who have reported not seeing it on your drives, look again.
> >Very carefully. You might have overlooked it.
> 
> >-Ron Hunsinger
> 
> Nope.  Still not there.
> 
> Brenda Bass
> bass...@usit.net

Definitely not there on my 6100/60. 
___

William T Goodall
w...@wtgab.demon.co.uk

W T Goodall wrote:
> 
> bass...@usit.net wrote:
> >
> > Nope.  Still not there.
> >
> > Brenda Bass
> > bass...@usit.net
> 
> Definitely not there on my 6100/60.

The logo is there on the drive, it's just covered up by the front bezel.
Remove the bezel, and there it is!

Pete
-- 
The opinions expressed here are not those of anyone, including myself.
No gerbils were harmed in the making of this message. Your mileage may
vary.

In article <519g9l$9...@sjx-ixn6.ix.netcom.com>,
	a...@ix.netcom.com(ANDREW GRYGUS ) writes:
> In <DxMFKr.Fz....@torfree.net> bb...@torfree.net (Eric Gallas)
> writes: 
> 
>>When doing some television alignment years back, it occured to me, the
>>easiest way to determine the field strength of a magnet was to hold it
>>to the screen of a television (switched on of course), and observe the
>>video effects, perhaps you could be more accure using a TV test generator,
>>and a camera on a tripod to measure the effects.
> 
> Yes, you can do this with a VGA color monitor.  A strong magnet will
> lightly magnetize the dot mask, causing lingering color aberations. 
> Yes, they eventually go away, that's what the degausing coil is for. 

Gotta be careful with this: if the field is too strong you can physically
bend the mask and get it out of alignment.  Degaussing isn't very useful
then...

Of course, there's no problem with mono tubes.

	J

Let me just start off by saying that yes, I of course know that this is a truly ancient thread.  However, I only just came across it today, and the fact that this phenomenon is still happening to this day is insane.  Maybe you didn’t believe it back then, but, having actually stopped a fellow student from doing this yesterday, I can assure you that it does in fact happen now.

I find myself looking towards our future with despair...

On Thu, 24 May 2018 08:31:23 -0700 (PDT), spawno...@gmail.com
wrote:

>Let me just start off by saying that yes, I of course know that this is a truly ancient thread.  However, I only just came across it today, and the fact that this phenomenon is still happening to this day is insane.  Maybe you didn’t believe it back then, but, having actually stopped a fellow student from doing this yesterday, I can assure you that it does in fact happen now.
>
>I find myself looking towards our future with despair...

About 2002, I know of a $100,000 per year manager who did the same
thing. Repeatedly. And when a compuyer tech got after him about it,
the tech was fired.