🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <27f8qt$g...@usenet.INS.CWRU.Edu> de...@po.CWRU.Edu (David E.  
Rives) writes:
> 
> 
> 
> Hi- I'm David... a new guy in this group, but a damned good Mortal  
Kombat 
> player. I saw this thread and the lack of messages. Hmmm....
> 
> The thing that makes groups go is not necessarily the subject, but the  
people
> posting to the subject. Sure, one can argue which game is the most  
intricate,
> or which group has the most die-hard fans. But regardless, if the MK  
folks 
> are not posting, there are probably a few reasons why not. I believe the
> reasons why this group is not alot lively are:
> 
> 	(1) People don't know about this group (like I didn't)
> 
--Plus, I'm not 100% sure that everyone around here has access to this  
group yet.  But you're right, there are a LOT of rgvs/rgvn/rgva AND even  
the occasional alt.games.sf2 post about MK [most often, "How can I do the  
moves?" or "Where's the FAQ?" or "Why are all these people asking 'How can  
I do the moves?' and 'Where's the FAQ?' over and over again?" but  
sometimes more subtle threads.]
	
> 	(2) MK fans are spread out ALL OVER the net. in the .sega group;
> 		and basically in all of the video game groups (you know 
> 		what they are...) I have seen MK discussed everywhere
> 		around here, at least in six different groups.
> 
> 	(3) The people here look like they are not reading everyday
> 		(Judging by reply time between posts).
> 
> 	(4) The posts here are quality posts. Alot of those high volume
> 		groups have many posts about BS. There simply are not 
> 		alot of stupid posts here.
>  
--On this you are right... high traffic has a high price.  
 
[more stuff]

> 	Getting back to the play to win/play to beat....
> 
> 	I think I generally play "fair", this is "fair" being moves that
> can generally be countered-- as opposed to moves such as Subzero's flip/
> freeze/flip combo, or Sonya's leg grab, etc. Those moves are considered 
> by many "cheap" because they can be virtually "uncounterable".
> 
> 	Also, I regard "cheapness" as continuously repeating a move for
> most of the match, or being extremely "defensive" during a match,  
forcing
> the opponent to HAVE to take the offensive. 

--I agree... although if I meet someone who plays "unfairly" then the  
worst I am likely to do to him is to watch him to fight the computer  
[which is something I just might have done anyway :-)]
> 
> 	But do you all ever notice how if you're playing againist someone,
> and they lose -- it may have even been a close match -- and that person 
> starts to get frustrated, (they don't realize this) their skills begin  
to
> deminish, as they get angry and become more and more irrational. 
> Interesting phenomenon to watch after continuously beating someone.
> 
--Oh, sure... this is quite common among more games than just MK.  It is  
also known to happen when one fights the computer & is having a hard  
time...

--The best SF II/MK/etc. players that I have seen were the guys who could  
keep their cool.  [Heh, heh & I'd be better if I could, too...]

> P.S.  Are there any female players in this newsgroup? I have never  
played 
> againist a female who was a serious player, with REAL skills. And I have 
> played alot in a few states...

--I've played MK some... enough to get each of the 7 character's ending by  
buying in... & I do peruse this group frequently, but as I got somewhat  
tired of the game & don't play it anymore, I rarely post here & have  
little to say.

Bethany Cox

"Splash Fount!"
--Charlotte

de...@po.CWRU.Edu (David E. Rives) writes:

>Hi- I'm David... a new guy in this group, but a damned good Mortal Kombat 
>player. I saw this thread and the lack of messages. Hmmm....
 
>The thing that makes groups go is not necessarily the subject, but the people
>posting to the subject. Sure, one can argue which game is the most intricate,
>or which group has the most die-hard fans. But regardless, if the MK folks 
>are not posting, there are probably a few reasons why not. I believe the
>reasons why this group is not alot lively are:
 
>	(1) People don't know about this group (like I didn't)
	
>	(2) MK fans are spread out ALL OVER the net. in the .sega group;
>		and basically in all of the video game groups (you know 
>		what they are...) I have seen MK discussed everywhere
>		around here, at least in six different groups.
 
>	(3) The people here look like they are not reading everyday
>		(Judging by reply time between posts).
 
>	(4) The posts here are quality posts. Alot of those high volume
>		groups have many posts about BS. There simply are not 
>		alot of stupid posts here.
 
 
>>die hard fans out there.  SF2 also has a lot more subtleties than MK -
>>by that I mean that many questions of the type, "what would happen if"
>>or "what is the best thing too if" still seem open ended among players. 
>>MK intercation is much cleaner and predictable, and most of the best
>>combos/strategies have been more or less exhausted.  One of MK's
>>strengths, character balance, is also a weakness when it comes to
>>promoting discussion.
 
 
>The number of messages in this group is DEFINITELY not porportional
>to how good MK is or the number of subtleties in the game or anything like
>that. Please don't start putting down one of the best co-ops ever because
>this newsgroup doesn't have many posters... or frequent posters.

Geez, David...  the original post asked why agsf2 gets lots of posts and
agmk doesn't.  A major reason IMO is because the nature of MK doesn't
lend itself to speculative discussion as much as SF2.  I never intended
to put MK down.  It is a completely different game.  This group is
fairly new, but it was advertised fairly extensively by Spencer Olsen
(and me, too) on the main bboards when it was first created.

>Are there any tricks/combos left to discover in MK?  I doubt it.  The
>devastation that is possible seems to be maximized in the FAQ.  Even the
>discovery of obscure bugs seem to have been exhausted...
 
 
>Puleeze, there are still many tricks to discover. I am one the
>best MK players I know, yet I spent all summer at UC
>(University of Cincinnati) where the competition is very high.
>And everytime I lost, I learned something new. (Going back to
>the play to beat/ play to win discussion) When people did the
>Sonya leg grab thing (which was the only way to get me off of
>the machine frequently),I wasnt upset, in fact, after getting
>whipped by that, I openly encouraged people to be cheap, so I could 
>learn how to play againist it.
 
>One of my favorite combos is when Im Subzero, get someone to 
>jump in front of you, freeze them in the air (at least a knees distance 
>off of the ground). Then walk over to them, punch them (either lo or hi), 
>and Quickly "jump kick" them, then slide under them. 3-PIECE!!! This works
>on ANY MK no matter what the version. I have done it on MANY MKs including 
>Genesis. 

The above is a perfect example of what my point was -- that combo has
been known for some time, and is in the FAQ.  The way to escape repeated
Sonya leg grabs is, too, BTW.  If you get ahold of the FAQ, and know
even one tidbit that isn't in there, I'd be very surprised...

>>I mean, there is only so much that can be discussed about ping pong.  It
>>is much more fun to play.
 
>Come on now!

You misunderstand!  I love ping pong!  It is pure skill!  There isn't
any deep strategy (though there are lots of tactics and plenty of
skill), and some shots are clearly tougher to return than others (but
harder to do, just like MK combos - damage vs. ease of execution).

But could a bboard be sustained with talk about ping pong?
 
>Getting back to the play to win/play to beat....
 
>I think I generally play "fair", this is "fair" being moves that
>can generally be countered-- as opposed to moves such as Subzero's flip/
>freeze/flip combo, or Sonya's leg grab, etc. Those moves are considered 
>by many "cheap" because they can be virtually "uncounterable".

I play to win :^)  And I'll tell someone how to escape any so-called
'virtually uncounterable' move if they complain.

>Also, I regard "cheapness" as continuously repeating a move for
>most of the match, or being extremely "defensive" during a match, forcing
>the opponent to HAVE to take the offensive. 

MK does seem to be biased towards the defensive (or more patient)
player.  So it goes.  All it would take in MK2 to encourage attacking
would be for missle attacks at a distance to take off a tiny sliver of
damage against ducking opponents, IMHO.

>[misc stuff about angry MK player deleted]
 
>P.S.  Are there any female players in this newsgroup? I have never played 
>againist a female who was a serious player, with REAL skills. And I have 
>played alot in a few states...

I know of one woman that is subscribed, and one that probably is (she's
really good, too).

Phil

In article <0gasSYm00...@andrew.cmu.edu> ps...@andrew.cmu.edu (Philip John Stroffolino) writes:
>
>The above is a perfect example of what my point was -- that combo has
>been known for some time, and is in the FAQ.  The way to escape repeated
>Sonya leg grabs is, too, BTW.  If you get ahold of the FAQ, and know
>even one tidbit that isn't in there, I'd be very surprised...
>

	Okay, the sub-zero slide after low kick isn't in there.  I've
only seen two people who were good enough to do it.

	The Johnny-cage cheese tactic wasn't there - where you kill a
computer cage by ducking and then roundhousing at just the right time. 

	The Kano reverse roll wasn't in the FAQ.

	The Johnny-cage groin punch being used as a jumping-kick
counter was absent.

	Using the roundhouse as a substitute for the upper cut wasn't
there (for use by the ninja-players).

	The hop-punch into the face wasn't in there.  This is where you
are close to your opponent and jump forward and immediately punch, either
catching your opponent off guard (they get nailed), forcing them to block
(they lose life), or causing you to fly past him and land on the other 
side (by the time they are turned around it is generally too late to punish
you).  This is a commonly known tactic, and usefull as well... but I heard
no mention of it.

>MK does seem to be biased towards the defensive (or more patient)
>player.  So it goes.  All it would take in MK2 to encourage attacking
>would be for missle attacks at a distance to take off a tiny sliver of
>damage against ducking opponents, IMHO.
>

	It doesn't seem that way to me.  It is simply the fact that a 
good player will PUNISH you for doing risky moves that less skilled 
players let slide.  Once you learn to only do things that are safe or
risky things at the right time, it is the offensive one who wins, not
the defensive.

	A good example is the punching battle.  The offense one is the
guy who is doing the punching.  The defensive one is the person who is
crouched and blocking, trying to retaliate with a low kick.  This
scenario is weighted highly for the offensive player, provided they
are good enough to block the low kick.

	-Michael