🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <68...@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM> to...@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM (Tom Almy) writes:
>
>The recent postings about computers with names ending in "AC" reminded
>me of the $15.00 "digital computers" sold in the back of Popular Science/
>Popular Mechanics type magazines in the late 50's and early 60's. It seems
>that the original one was called the GENIAC ("GENIus Automatic Computer?")
>but there was a falling out of the owners and another one called "BRAINIAC"
>was sold at roughly the same price. The BRANIAC advertisements typically
>mentioned the GENIAC, saying they had everything that the early GENIACs had
>and more.

[nice account deleted]

>Was this anyone elses first computer?

I didn't have a Braniac though I remember the ads well.  I did have the red
plastic flip flop computer kit (from Edmund?).  It had a series of inter-
connecting flip flops that were programmed by adding or removing plastic
stubs.  It had a three digit binary readout.  This was in 1965 and took me
at least two or three days to assemble.  I only remember one program from
the instruction book.  It solved the problem of three men crossing a river
with a boat that holds only two (or something like that).  Mainly it taught
me binary arithmetic.  Boy, I wish I still had it!  (I would too, except that
my house burned a couple of years later, [sigh]).

					Andrew MacRae

In article <8...@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> a...@grendal.EBay.Sun.COM (Andrew MacRae) writes:
>In article <68...@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM> to...@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM (Tom Almy) writes:
>>Was this anyone elses first computer?
>
>I didn't have a Braniac though I remember the ads well.  I did have the red
>plastic flip flop computer kit (from Edmund?).  It had a series of inter-

Yes!  But what was it called?
My parents may still have it around; I'll have to search.

Otherwise, playing on a DEC-10 in '73, but then an Altair 8800
with 1K of RAM.  First program on the Altrair was a sort.
(Later I found out that von Neuman's 1st program for ENIAC
was also a sort.)  The sort program was also my 1st into
to complexity analysis;  It took a lot longer when we expanded
to 4K.

Preston Briggs
pre...@titan.rice.edu

In article <48...@brazos.Rice.edu> pre...@titan.rice.edu (Preston Briggs) writes:
>In article <8...@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> a...@grendal.EBay.Sun.COM (Andrew MacRae) writes:
>>In article <68...@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM> to...@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM (Tom Almy) writes:
>>>Was this anyone elses first computer?
>>
>>I didn't have a Braniac though I remember the ads well.  I did have the red
>>plastic flip flop computer kit (from Edmund?).  It had a series of inter-
>
>Yes!  But what was it called?
>My parents may still have it around; I'll have to search.
>

Well, I suppose you could count "Cardiac" (sic), a cardboard sliding-part
based computer that was used in my high school's introduction to computers
class.  Does anyone else remember (or even have one of) _those_?
-- 
Christopher Pettus                   | "I used to think the mind was
Network Connectivity Development     | the most important part of a
Apple Computer, Inc. MS 35-K         | person.  Then I realized what
c...@apple.com   {nsc, sun}!apple!cep | part of me is telling me that."
AppleLink: PETTUS.C                  |

In article <65...@internal.Apple.COM> c...@Apple.COM (Christopher Pettus) writes:
>In article <48...@brazos.Rice.edu> pre...@titan.rice.edu (Preston Briggs) writes:
>>In article <8...@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> a...@grendal.EBay.Sun.COM (Andrew MacRae) writes:
>>>In article <68...@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM> to...@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM (Tom Almy) writes:
>>>>Was this anyone elses first computer?
>>>
>>>I didn't have a Braniac though I remember the ads well.  I did have the red
>>>plastic flip flop computer kit (from Edmund?).  It had a series of inter-
>>
>>Yes!  But what was it called?
>>My parents may still have it around; I'll have to search.

[Much stuff deleted here]

It was called "DIGICOMP", and came in both basic and advanced models, as I
remember.

The program I remember simulated an elevator.

Another interesting point:  The device had its own user group.

Harold Stuart

In article <38...@apple.Apple.COM>, stu...@Apple.COM (Harold Stuart) writes:
> It was called "DIGICOMP", and came in both basic and advanced models, as I
> remember.

    I just dug my DIGI-COMP 1 (the "first real operating digital
    computer in plastic") out of a box on the top of the shelf in my
    office.  It's in pretty good shape considering it's moved about
    seven times - the only things missing are the little L-shaped
    springs that served to keep the flips from flopping.

    The maker was E.S.R., inc. (Edmund Scientific???), Montclair, NJ:

	"E.S.R., Inc. was founded several years ago by three scientists
	and engineers who wanted to provide toys and educational
	devices that would have those qualities that lead children and
	adults to fuller and more successful lives - and yet bring
	enjoyment to all.  Their first attempt, DIGI-COMP 1, was an
	instant success.  Today, tens of thousands of youngsters and
	adults in America and Canada have enjoyed DIGI-COMP and now
	have been introduced to the computer field.  Over a thousand
	public and private schools have used DIGI-COMP for classroom
	demonstrations.  New textbooks in Science and Mathematics are
	including a discussion of DIGI-COMP.  With the new advanced
	manual now available for DIGI-COMP a very though examination of
	computer math an fundamentals is now a reality for all."

    Rather poignantly, the coupon for the "Detailed Programming of
    the Experiments in Digi-Comp 1" manual on the back of the `old
    unadvanced' manual that I do have is filled out in my adolescent
    scrawl.  The manual cost a dollar that I suppose I didn't have at
    the time.

    I always wondered about the `1' part of the name, perhaps the
    DIGI-COMP 2 manipulated more than a single octal digit!

> The program I remember simulated an elevator.

    The manual (dated 1963) lists the following `experiments':

	Check Out
	Final Count Down
	Automatic Elevator
	Bank Lock
	Sequential Bank Lock
	Ho-Hum (described as a `logical riddle')
	Space Ship Check Out
	Guess The Number
	Space Capsule Re-Entry
	Binary Counter
	Game of NIM
	Binary Number Comparator
	Binary addition, subtraction, multiplication, (no division...)

    The section titled `What is a Computer?' concludes with:

	"EVERYTHING YOU LEARN ON DIGI-COMP CAN BE USED ON LARGE
	ELECTRONIC DIGITAL COMPUTERS"  (capitals theirs)

Rob Seaman (Nat'l. Optical Astronomy Obs., sea...@noao.edu)

Oh, yes, CARDIAC.  The CARDboard Illustriative Aid to Computation.
I think Bell Labs put the thing out, if I remember right.  I still
have mine, somewhere.  It's twenty years old by now, I'm sure.  To
tie this in to another ongoing discussion here, CARDIAC has a bug
without which it wouldn't work.  The program counter was a paper
ladybug with a long nose that stuck in the holes next to the spots
where you wrote down the instructions (memory).  There was a sliding
instruction decoder, too.  Just the thing to impress the hell out
of an 11-year-old (quick, how old am I?).

-- 
-- 
Jeff Woolsey	Microtec Research, Inc	+1 408 980-1300
...!apple!netcom!woolsey	...!amdcad!sun0!woolsey

In article <65...@internal.Apple.COM> c...@Apple.COM (Christopher Pettus) writes:
>Well, I suppose you could count "Cardiac" (sic), a cardboard sliding-part
>based computer that was used in my high school's introduction to computers
>class.  Does anyone else remember (or even have one of) _those_?

YES, I remember.  It was an old one and had been lying in the drawer (or
wherever it came from) for _years_.  My mother (a RN) wanted to look at it, but
I tried to explain to her that it had nothing to do with human hearts....
--
"Workers of the world, we're sorry!" --Soviet protestor's slogan

Kenneth Arromdee (UUCP: ....!jhunix!arromdee; BITNET: arromdee@jhuvm;
     INTERNET: arro...@crabcake.cs.jhu.edu)

As I recall, the big problem with the Brainiac was that it had cadmium
plated screws instead of the brass ones that came with the Geniac - and
the cad screws didn't make good contact when you turned the masonite
disks to alter the machine settings, so your light bulb outputs would
flicker.  The cure was to polish the screw heads with fine crocus cloth
or emery paper.

I dunno what one of the young Turks who fix machines nowadays would
say if you told him that you had gotten your start in computing 
polishing the heads of your disks with sandpaper....

I must have been all of ten years old at the time.
	- Brian

In article <8...@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> a...@grendal.EBay.Sun.COM (Andrew MacRae) writes:
>[...]
>I didn't have a Braniac though I remember the ads well.  I did have the red
>plastic flip flop computer kit (from Edmund?).  It had a series of inter-
>connecting flip flops that were programmed by adding or removing plastic
>stubs.  It had a three digit binary readout.  This was in 1965 and took me

Me, too!  It was called a DigiComp (-I?).  Anybody want to sell me one, or
sell me pictures enough to maybe recreate one?

/** --poko	" I'm half Estonian, which makes up for the other half. "
Pete Klammer/Systems Programmer/(303)556-3915	PKLA...@PIKES.COLORADO.EDU
CU-Denver Computing Services / Campus Box 169	BITNET: PKLAMMER@CUDENVER
1200 Larimer St NC2506 / Denver CO 80204-5300	UU:!boulder!pikes!pklammer **/



-- 
/** --poko	" I'm half Estonian, which makes up for the other half. "
Pete Klammer/Systems Programmer/(303)556-3915	PKLA...@PIKES.COLORADO.EDU
CU-Denver Computing Services / Campus Box 169	BITNET: PKLAMMER@CUDENVER
1200 Larimer St NC2506 / Denver CO 80204-5300	UU:!boulder!pikes!pklammer **/

>Well, I suppose you could count "Cardiac" (sic), a cardboard sliding-part
>based computer that was used in my high school's introduction to computers

Oooh, we used t' dream of 'avin' cardboard computer.  We made do wi' paper!

Seriously, Look in IRE (now IEEE) Transactions on Electronic Computers,
volume 7, number 4, September 1958, pp 254-8.  This is the Science Education
Subcommitte Newsletter section, which features PAPAC-00 by Rollin P. Mayer.
A build-it-yourself 1 bit 1 instruction computer requiring only a copy of
the article and some pins.

One of my students built one of these last month, from 80 gram per square
meter paper. Yes, it does work. I suppose that you could argue about just
how programmable it is, but does a journal with a built-in computer beat
smart cards?

Is this the progenitor of "The Hitch-Hikers' Guide to The Galaxy"?

-Iain..

p.s. I've just thought.  I could fax that computer to someone (copyright
permitting).  Electronic transfer of a _processor_.  The first computer
_hardware_ to be protected by copyright instead of patent?

Gentlemen:
  I think you are all dating us....

  I started reading this thread and couldn't believe it.  I had both
ot these thingys as a child.

  Imagine that, a bright red and whit plastic computer and a piece
of masonite with screws and fasteners. (Did you all have to align the
slots in the machine screws to get it to work?).

  Did anyone else build the 'paper-clip' computer that was published
is a paper-back, complete with drum memory?

Bill Robison

I loved those ESR toys.  They were not made by Edmund.

DIGICOMP (I) was my first computer.  I mastered programming the thing
with their stubby "logic" rods and long "clock" rods.  It was actually
quite clever.

Other ESR computers:

DIGICOMP II - This was a quite impressive step up from DIGICOMP I.
It resembled a cross between a pinball machine and a pachinko machine, 
with marbles rolling down zig-zag paths, triggering flip-flops, falling
into holes, down chutes, etc.   Because of all the moving parts, it never
QUITE worked the way it should have: marbles jammed, triggers didn't trigger,
etc.  It was quite instructive because it probably is the best toy model
of how electronic computer components actually work.

THINK-A-DOT - Remember this one?  A red and white plastic thing measuring
about 10cm (H) x 10cm (W) x 3cm (D).  It had three holes on top, and an
array of 8 flip flops with blue/yellow readout dots on the front.  You
would plunk marbles down the holes for various effects.  You initialized
the thing by tilting it to one side, so all the flip-flops would
orient themselves.

DR. NIM - This special-purpose computer played a perfect game of nim.
In the grand ESR tradition, marbles (surprise!) raced their way around a 
red plastic track, triggering white plastic flip-flops.  You 
could set it for automatic mode, where a constant stream of marbles would 
be triggered from the reservoir at the top.  I recall seeing ads 
on TV for only this one: (echoey voiceover: "Doctor Nimmmmmmmm"!).


Yeah, I had that Geniac thing.  Cheap masonite and sleasy jumpers and
wires.  The thing never did work right; nor did it interest me as much
as the ESR's.  It is probably in some closet at my boyhood home, 
conspiring with the neglected chemistry set, planning to take over the
home.
-- 

Daniel Pearl  da...@westford.ccur.com
c/o Concurrent Computer Corp - 1 Technology Way -- Westford, MA 01886           

In article <65...@internal.Apple.COM> c...@Apple.COM (Christopher Pettus) writes:
>
>Well, I suppose you could count "Cardiac" (sic), a cardboard sliding-part
>based computer that was used in my high school's introduction to computers
>class.  Does anyone else remember (or even have one of) _those_?

Yes, I used one circa 1971.  As I remember it used a 'ladybug' shaped
piece of cardboard for the instruction pointer.  Should I add this to
the 'bug in the computer' thread?? :')

Leo Rainer

Building Energy Analysis
Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory
LIRa...@lbl.gov

In article <1990Feb9.0...@noao.edu> sea...@noao.edu (Rob Seaman CCS) writes:
>In article <38...@apple.Apple.COM>, stu...@Apple.COM (Harold Stuart) writes:
>> It was called "DIGICOMP", and came in both basic and advanced models, as I
>> remember.
>
>    I just dug my DIGI-COMP 1 (the "first real operating digital
>    computer in plastic") out of a box on the top of the shelf in my
>    office.

Yep, and I had one too, besides my Geniac.  This thing actually worked
well (unlike the Geniac), but it wasn't as flexible. I was also much older
when I got it. I know it didn't seem to take quite the bite out of my
finances.

So the Geniac/Brainiac dates back to 1958, or earlier (?).
The DIGI-COMP was about 1963 (judging from a posting)
The Cardiac was about 1970 (judging from a posting)

Any other early "home computers," or particularly any before the
Geniac/Brainiac?  How about it, historians? These things weren't
technological marvels -- they all could have been made any time in this
century.

Tom Almy
to...@tekgvs.labs.tek.com
Standard Disclaimers Apply

In article <23.25...@iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu>, syswtr@iowasp writes:
| Gentlemen:
|   I think you are all dating us....
| 
|   I started reading this thread and couldn't believe it.  I had both
| ot these thingys as a child.

I had both a Cardiac and a Digi-comp.  They're gone now.

I wrote a BASIC program to simulate Cardiac.  Did anyone else do that?

I also noticed that the mechanical parts of my Digi-comp would
sometimes generate errors.  And, I wondered about the people that
could actually take a problem and generate some apparently random
collection of long and short tubes to make the problem solveable.
Now, I do that for a living (but with pipes instead of tubes... :-).

Just another person dating themselves (because nobody else will :-),
-- 
/=Randal L. Schwartz, Stonehenge Consulting Services (503)777-0095 ==========\
| on contract to Intel's iWarp project, Beaverton, Oregon, USA, Sol III      |
| mer...@iwarp.intel.com ...!any-MX-mailer-like-uunet!iwarp.intel.com!merlyn |
\=Cute Quote: "Welcome to Portland, Oregon, home of the California Raisins!"=/

In article <65...@internal.Apple.COM> c...@Apple.COM (Christopher Pettus) writes
about early "computers":
>
> Well, I suppose you could count "Cardiac" (sic), a cardboard sliding-part
> based computer that was used in my high school's introduction to computers
> class.  Does anyone else remember (or even have one of) _those_?

  Yea, I have one still, bought it by mailorder for US$ 12.- from Bell
  Labs (I think; can't remember properly).  Great stuff... a _real_
  paper-computer with one register, 100 memory locations, programmed in
  3-digit decimal code using a 10-command assembly language, complete
  with a pointer to the current memory cell in the shape of a lady-bug  ;-)

  I only ever wrote one and a half program for it though... some sort
  of a generic "add two values and output it in cell 100" routine from
  the book and (half of) something else that was even simpler than that.

  I much preferred my first BBC Micro though...

--Ian Feldman /  ia...@nada.kth.se || uunet!nada.kth.se!ianf
             / "just an average self-unemployed ascii hacker"

In article <1990Feb9.2...@iwarp.intel.com>
	mer...@iwarp.intel.com (Randal Schwartz) writes:
>I had both a Cardiac and a Digi-comp.  They're gone now.
Me too!
>I wrote a BASIC program to simulate Cardiac.  Did anyone else do that?
Yup.
					-=EPS=-
-- 
You know you're getting old when what you call "life" is what
others deem "nostalgia."

In article <8...@jethro.Corp.Sun.COM> a...@grendal.EBay.Sun.COM (Andrew MacRae) writes:
>I didn't have a Braniac though I remember the ads well.  I did have the red
>plastic flip flop computer kit (from Edmund?).  It had a series of inter-
>connecting flip flops that were programmed by adding or removing plastic
>stubs.  It had a three digit binary readout.  This was in 1965 and took me
>at least two or three days to assemble.  I only remember one program from
>the instruction book.  It solved the problem of three men crossing a river
>with a boat that holds only two (or something like that).  Mainly it taught
>me binary arithmetic.  Boy, I wish I still had it!  (I would too, except that
>my house burned a couple of years later, [sigh]).

I had something like this, but it was called a Digi-Comp.  Don't
remember when it was but it had to be before 1970 -- probably between
1968 and 1970.  Previous versions had used rubber bands to work it,
but this was a new version that used tiny springs made out of thin
copper wire, and they broke or got lost easily.

I never really understood how it worked.  I got it to do what it was
supposed to, but I didn't understand why.

In article <29...@draken.nada.kth.se>, ianf@nada (Ian Feldman) writes:
]In article <65...@internal.Apple.COM> c...@Apple.COM (Christopher Pettus) writes
]about early "computers":
]>
]> Well, I suppose you could count "Cardiac" (sic), a cardboard sliding-part
]> based computer that was used in my high school's introduction to computers
]> class.  Does anyone else remember (or even have one of) _those_?
]
]  Yea, I have one still, bought it by mailorder for US$ 12.- from Bell
]  Labs (I think; can't remember properly).  Great stuff... a _real_
]  paper-computer with one register, 100 memory locations, programmed in
]  3-digit decimal code using a 10-command assembly language, complete
]  with a pointer to the current memory cell in the shape of a lady-bug  ;-)

I got my paws on a few of them back in elementary school (for some
reason one of the teachers got a whole bunch of them & handed them out
to all interested parties).  I remember that the PC (ladybug) kept
getting lost, so I modified it by attaching it with a piece of wire (one
of my more successful hardware hacks :-) ).

]  I only ever wrote one and a half program for it though... some sort
]  of a generic "add two values and output it in cell 100" routine from
]  the book and (half of) something else that was even simpler than that.

The double precision arithmetic was neat, though.

I could probably still dig the thing out next time I visit my parents.
-- 
ames >>>>>>>>>  |	Robert Krawitz <r...@think.com>	245 First St.
bloom-beacon >  |think!rlk	(postmaster)		Cambridge, MA  02142
harvard >>>>>>  .	Thinking Machines Corp.		(617)876-1111

In article <3...@toaster.SFSU.EDU> e...@cs.SFSU.EDU (Eric P. Scott) writes:
>In article <1990Feb9.2...@iwarp.intel.com>
>	mer...@iwarp.intel.com (Randal Schwartz) writes:
>>I had both a Cardiac and a Digi-comp.  They're gone now.
>Me too!
>>I wrote a BASIC program to simulate Cardiac.  Did anyone else do that?
>Yup.

I'll go you one better---for a junior-level digital design lab, I *built* a
Cardiac CPU using bit-slice components.  We hardwired the little bootstrap
program into the reset logic and hooked up a hex keypad to download your
program.  Beat the pants off the cardboard implementation in benchmarks,
but it was a lot harder to debug :-)

Thinking about it, I've probably lost both the original and the design
charts for the project :-(  That was the last time I touched a wire-wrap
tool, also.  Fun times.








--
===============================================================================
Pete Halverson                           INET: halv...@crd.ge.com 
GE Corporate R&D Center	                 UUCP: uunet!crd.ge.com!halverson
Schenectady, NY                     "Money for nuthin' and your MIPS for free"

In article <95...@masscomp.ccur.com> danny@masscomp.UUCP (Dan Pearl) writes:
#
# DIGICOMP II - [ lots of marbles and moving parts... ]
# 
# THINK-A-DOT - [ more marbles and flip-flops ]
# 
# DR. NIM - [ yet more marbles and flip-flops ]

I assume by this we could state, almost accurately, that when a processor,
I/O or otherwise, ceases to function/flies south/keels over/explodes/hangs,
it has "Lost its Marbles..."?
# -- 
# 
# Daniel Pearl  da...@westford.ccur.com
# c/o Concurrent Computer Corp - 1 Technology Way -- Westford, MA 01886           


-- 
Brain fried.  (Explanation is in file "core".)

In article <23.25...@iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu> sys...@iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu writes:
>   Did anyone else build the 'paper-clip' computer that was published
>   is a paper-back, complete with drum memory?

I did! I think I was 9 or 10.  Yes, I was a self-admitted "Geek Child".  I wish
I could remember where I found the plans for the thing (I actually think it was
in a book from Radio Sh*ck?).  The drum memory consisted of an old tin juice
can, and the program was masking tape placed on the can, with holes thru which
paper clips made contact with the drum completeing a circuit.  Temporary
storage ("registers") were in the form of paper clip switches, and of course,
plenty of lamps for output.  That's how I learned "binary".

I remember programming the thing to learn the game of tic-tac-toe (I cheated -
used a die as the random number generator).  Once it learned correctly, it
would tie at best.

Since it required manual operation, I eventually hooked the drum up to the
motor from my erector set and programmed it to count in BCD.  Then I arranged
the lights in the shape of 7-segment digits, and used the thing as a timer for
our race track.  The passing car would turn on and off a switch for timing laps
(I warned you I was a geek child... I still owe my mother a a robot for house
chores that I promised to build her.  She still bugs me about it every chance
she gets!).  When I got real fancy, I included a set of "racing lights" (the
start bar, like at the drag races: red, yellow, green) with the timer.

--
Disclaimer: All spelling and/or grammer in this document are guaranteed to be
            correct; any exseptions is the is wurk uv intter-net deemuns.

Mike McManus (mik...@ncr-fc.FtCollins.ncr.com)  
NCR Microelectronics                
2001 Danfield Ct.                   ncr-fc!mik...@ncr-sd.sandiego.ncr.com, or
Ft. Collins,  Colorado              ncr-fc!mik...@ccncsu.colostate.edu, or
(303) 223-5100   Ext. 360           uunet!ncrlnk!ncr-sd!ncr-fc!garage!mikemc
                                    

In article <MIKEMC.90F...@mustang.ncr-fc.FtCollins.NCR.com> mik...@mustang.ncr-fc.FtCollins.NCR.com (Mike McManus) writes:
>   I remember programming the thing to learn the game of tic-tac-toe (I 
>   cheated - used a die as the random number generator).  Once it learned 
>   correctly, it would tie at best.
                        ^^^^^^^^^^^
Not too impressive, huh?  Make that tie at *WORST* (and I thot I was just a
good tic-tac-toe player!).
--
Disclaimer: All spelling and/or grammer in this document are guaranteed to be
            correct; any exseptions is the is wurk uv intter-net deemuns.

Mike McManus (mik...@ncr-fc.FtCollins.ncr.com)  
NCR Microelectronics                
2001 Danfield Ct.                   ncr-fc!mik...@ncr-sd.sandiego.ncr.com, or
Ft. Collins,  Colorado              ncr-fc!mik...@ccncsu.colostate.edu, or
(303) 223-5100   Ext. 360           uunet!ncrlnk!ncr-sd!ncr-fc!garage!mikemc