🚀 go-pugleaf

Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.

The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?

EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
for me to face.

On 26 Apr 2006 12:58:46 -0700, "Eve Player" <ultimangel@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
>into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>
>The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
>actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
>and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
>a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>
>EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
>that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
>dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>for me to face.

Condolences on your loss.  I am grateful that I can only begin to
imagine how it feels to lose a child, particularly in this way.  I
pray that is always true.

Are you receiving any counselling?  When my eldest daughter had
problems some years ago, we sought help for her, but none for
ourselves.  I believe that if we had we sought help for ourselves, we
would be in a better position now.

Lemming
-- 
Curiosity *may* have killed Schrodinger's cat.

"Eve Player" <ultimangel@hotmail.com> writes:

> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>
> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>
> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
> for me to face.
>

Are they to blame or something? What happened?

>> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
>> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>>
>> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
>> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
>> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
>> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>>
>> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
>> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
>> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>> for me to face.
>>
>
> Are they to blame or something? What happened?

Nothing happend, probably some tosser that got his accounts banned for 
cheating or what not and
try find a way to get back at EVE. If something like this really happend it 
would come out into the
EVE community quite fast, and no such thing have surfaced on the EVE 
grapevine. Don't feed the trolls please ;-)

"Erland Andreassen" <wsg@lways-nospam-.online.no> writes:

>>> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
>>> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>>> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>>>
>>> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
>>> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
>>> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
>>> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>>>
>>> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
>>> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
>>> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>>> for me to face.
>>>
>>
>> Are they to blame or something? What happened?
>
> Nothing happend, probably some tosser that got his accounts banned for 
> cheating or what not and
> try find a way to get back at EVE. If something like this really happend it 
> would come out into the
> EVE community quite fast, and no such thing have surfaced on the EVE 
> grapevine. Don't feed the trolls please ;-)
>
>

It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
some truth in it.

>
>
>

-- 
lithp : syntax error

"Hadron Quark" <hadronquark@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com...
> "Erland Andreassen" <wsg@lways-nospam-.online.no> writes:
>
>>>> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
>>>> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>>>> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>>>>
>>>> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
>>>> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
>>>> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
>>>> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>>>>
>>>> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
>>>> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
>>>> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>>>> for me to face.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Are they to blame or something? What happened?
>>
>> Nothing happend, probably some tosser that got his accounts banned for
>> cheating or what not and
>> try find a way to get back at EVE. If something like this really happend 
>> it
>> would come out into the
>> EVE community quite fast, and no such thing have surfaced on the EVE
>> grapevine. Don't feed the trolls please ;-)
>>
>>
>
> It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
> some truth in it.

It is a heart wrenching story. I hope for "Eve Player" it is not true 
because that is very sad. I've had friends that lost loved ones through 
suicide and it is very damaging to everyone around them. It would be 
especially horribly tragic for the parents. 

"Hadron Quark" <hadronquark@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com...
> It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
> some truth in it.

Too bad the imature schmucks in c.s.i.p.g.action aren't as thoughtful
or mature.

"Jim Vieira" <WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> wrote in message
news:FFa4g.6785$k.2864@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> "Hadron Quark" <hadronquark@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com...
> > It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
> > some truth in it.
>
> Too bad the imature schmucks in c.s.i.p.g.action aren't as thoughtful
> or mature.

Woops, I mean c.s.i.p.g.rpg

In message <dGa4g.6786$k.3520@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com>, Jim Vieira 
<WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> writes
>"Jim Vieira" <WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> wrote in message
>news:FFa4g.6785$k.2864@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>> "Hadron Quark" <hadronquark@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com...
>> > It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
>> > some truth in it.
>>
>> Too bad the imature schmucks in c.s.i.p.g.action aren't as thoughtful
>> or mature.
>
>Woops, I mean c.s.i.p.g.rpg
>
>
As the guys over in c.s.i.p.g.rpg have pointed out, this is a troll, or 
at the very least someone spinning a line for his own reasons. If it was 
true, it would show up on Google for sure, which it doesn't, and it 
would be all over the Eve forums, which it isn't. Especially since he 
claims his character has 35 million skill points, which means he has 
been playing continuously since the early days of the game and would be 
well known around the community. "Thoughtful and mature" is only 
relevant if the story were true; if it's not then "gullible" is the 
word. People are far too ready to believe the obviously incredible 
rather than appear rude.
-- 
John Secker

> It is a heart wrenching story. I hope for "Eve Player" it is not true 
> because that is very sad. I've had friends that lost loved ones through 
> suicide and it is very damaging to everyone around them. It would be 
> especially horribly tragic for the parents.

The EVE community have experienced deaths of several players through 
accidents, sickness and such, and when such things happens there is often 
tribute threads and such on the eve-online forums etc. If any of this had 
been true it would surfaced.

John Secker wrote:
> In message <dGa4g.6786$k.3520@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com>, Jim Vieira 
> <WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> writes
>> "Jim Vieira" <WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> wrote in message
>> news:FFa4g.6785$k.2864@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>> "Hadron Quark" <hadronquark@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com...
>>> > It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there 
>>> was
>>> > some truth in it.
>>>
>>> Too bad the imature schmucks in c.s.i.p.g.action aren't as thoughtful
>>> or mature.
>>
>> Woops, I mean c.s.i.p.g.rpg
>>
>>
> As the guys over in c.s.i.p.g.rpg have pointed out, this is a troll, or 
> at the very least someone spinning a line for his own reasons. If it was 
> true, it would show up on Google for sure, which it doesn't, and it 
> would be all over the Eve forums, which it isn't. Especially since he 
> claims his character has 35 million skill points, which means he has 
> been playing continuously since the early days of the game and would be 
> well known around the community. "Thoughtful and mature" is only 
> relevant if the story were true; if it's not then "gullible" is the 
> word. People are far too ready to believe the obviously incredible 
> rather than appear rude.

Aw, J.S. you spoilt the joke! Everyone in *.rpg has been having a good 
laugh at the way the space-sim jockeys have been so humanitarian and 
comforting to an obvious jerk. They don't even know which NG they've 
been snooping on! Typical Americans, you'll swallow anything, including 
a Nazi world-domination government. ;-)

On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 00:42:34 GMT, KeithB <nospam@spambin.net> wrote:

>John Secker wrote:
>> In message <dGa4g.6786$k.3520@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com>, Jim Vieira 
>> <WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> writes
>>> "Jim Vieira" <WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> wrote in message
>>> news:FFa4g.6785$k.2864@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>>> "Hadron Quark" <hadronquark@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com...
>>>> > It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there 
>>>> was
>>>> > some truth in it.
>>>>
>>>> Too bad the imature schmucks in c.s.i.p.g.action aren't as thoughtful
>>>> or mature.
>>>
>>> Woops, I mean c.s.i.p.g.rpg
>>>
>>>
>> As the guys over in c.s.i.p.g.rpg have pointed out, this is a troll, or 
>> at the very least someone spinning a line for his own reasons. If it was 
>> true, it would show up on Google for sure, which it doesn't, and it 
>> would be all over the Eve forums, which it isn't. Especially since he 
>> claims his character has 35 million skill points, which means he has 
>> been playing continuously since the early days of the game and would be 
>> well known around the community. "Thoughtful and mature" is only 
>> relevant if the story were true; if it's not then "gullible" is the 
>> word. People are far too ready to believe the obviously incredible 
>> rather than appear rude.
>
>Aw, J.S. you spoilt the joke! Everyone in *.rpg has been having a good 
>laugh at the way the space-sim jockeys have been so humanitarian and 
>comforting to an obvious jerk. They don't even know which NG they've 
>been snooping on! Typical Americans, you'll swallow anything, including 
>a Nazi world-domination government. ;-)

The thought went through my mind that the OP was likely a troll, or
someone's twisted idea of a joke.  This was why I waited a day or two
to respond, as I couldn't make up my mind which it was.  It appears
the latter was true - at least as far as you are concerned, Keith.

But I also wondered if this was someone who really had lost their son,
and irrespective of whether there was any link to Eve or not, it was
better to assume this was the case than to take the piss or leave the
guy hanging with no replies.  Just because csigps-s is a (flaming)
gaming group doesn't mean we have to leave our humanity at the door.

Just because the Eve groups aren't buzzing with this story doesn't
mean there is no truth to it.  Do you have sufficient empathy to
realise that someone in the situation described in the OP might need
to search for a reason, and might seize upon anything they could think
of to alleviate their pain?  Never mind; forget I asked.

ObSpaceSim: *BING!*

Regards,

Lemming
-- 
Curiosity *may* have killed Schrodinger's cat.

On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 10:16:30 +0100, Lemming wrote:

> On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 00:42:34 GMT, KeithB <nospam@spambin.net> wrote:
> 
>>John Secker wrote:
>>> In message <dGa4g.6786$k.3520@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com>, Jim Vieira 
>>> <WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> writes
>>>> "Jim Vieira" <WhiplashrAT@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:FFa4g.6785$k.2864@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>>>>> "Hadron Quark" <hadronquark@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com...
>>>>> > It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there 
>>>>> was
>>>>> > some truth in it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Too bad the imature schmucks in c.s.i.p.g.action aren't as thoughtful
>>>>> or mature.
>>>>
>>>> Woops, I mean c.s.i.p.g.rpg
>>>>
>>>>
>>> As the guys over in c.s.i.p.g.rpg have pointed out, this is a troll, or 
>>> at the very least someone spinning a line for his own reasons. If it was 
>>> true, it would show up on Google for sure, which it doesn't, and it 
>>> would be all over the Eve forums, which it isn't. Especially since he 
>>> claims his character has 35 million skill points, which means he has 
>>> been playing continuously since the early days of the game and would be 
>>> well known around the community. "Thoughtful and mature" is only 
>>> relevant if the story were true; if it's not then "gullible" is the 
>>> word. People are far too ready to believe the obviously incredible 
>>> rather than appear rude.
>>
>>Aw, J.S. you spoilt the joke! Everyone in *.rpg has been having a good 
>>laugh at the way the space-sim jockeys have been so humanitarian and 
>>comforting to an obvious jerk. They don't even know which NG they've 
>>been snooping on! Typical Americans, you'll swallow anything, including 
>>a Nazi world-domination government. ;-)
> 
> The thought went through my mind that the OP was likely a troll, or
> someone's twisted idea of a joke.  This was why I waited a day or two
> to respond, as I couldn't make up my mind which it was.  It appears
> the latter was true - at least as far as you are concerned, Keith.
> 
> But I also wondered if this was someone who really had lost their son,
> and irrespective of whether there was any link to Eve or not, it was
> better to assume this was the case than to take the piss or leave the
> guy hanging with no replies.  Just because csigps-s is a (flaming)
> gaming group doesn't mean we have to leave our humanity at the door.
> 
> Just because the Eve groups aren't buzzing with this story doesn't
> mean there is no truth to it.  Do you have sufficient empathy to
> realise that someone in the situation described in the OP might need
> to search for a reason, and might seize upon anything they could think
> of to alleviate their pain?  Never mind; forget I asked.
> 
> ObSpaceSim: *BING!*
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Lemming

I can't decide which I like better: the idea that Lemming has just been
called a "Typical American," or just the bare fact that a man called
/Lemming/ is commenting on suicide.  It's like something from "Creature
Comforts" (http://snipurl.com/psn7 for the uninitiated).

Regardless of the OP's situation or intent, Lemming's motives are
admirable.  He's still basically a bastard, but even Homer nods.

Bret

John Secker wrote:
> 
> People are far too ready to believe the obviously incredible
> rather than appear rude.

"The curse of man, and cause of nearly all of his woes, 
 is his stupendous capacity for believing the incredible."
     - H. L. Mencken

;)


  - Sheldon

"Bret Ripley" <ripley@gotsky.com> wrote in message 
news:ep1sg1f0ws4d$.12xpkobd59bq$.dlg@40tude.net...

> Regardless of the OP's situation or intent, Lemming's motives are
> admirable.  He's still basically a bastard, but even Homer nods.

I always thought that he was basically a good guy but the bastard facade was 
just pervasive? 

On or about Thu, 27 Apr 2006 14:15:24 +0200, some person or persons unknown
calling themselves Hadron Quark ", did cause <87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com> to
appear on my glass typewriter and spake thus:
>
>"Erland Andreassen" <wsg@lways-nospam-.online.no> writes:
>
>>>> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
>>>> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>>>> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>>>>
>>>> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
>>>> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
>>>> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
>>>> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>>>>
>>>> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
>>>> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
>>>> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>>>> for me to face.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Are they to blame or something? What happened?
>>
>> Nothing happend, probably some tosser that got his accounts banned for 
>> cheating or what not and
>> try find a way to get back at EVE. If something like this really happend it 
>> would come out into the
>> EVE community quite fast, and no such thing have surfaced on the EVE 
>> grapevine. Don't feed the trolls please ;-)
>>
>>
>
>It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
>some truth in it.
>

Yes, if you are looking for comfort and love, and a caring shoulder to cry on,
c.s.i.p.g-space-sim is the place to go.

Everyone is treated like a decent human being here.


-- 
NewsGuy.Com 30Gb $9.95 Carry Forward and On Demand Bandwidth

On Sat, 29 Apr 2006 01:18:54 GMT, Bill Huffman wrote:

> "Bret Ripley" <ripley@gotsky.com> wrote in message 
> news:ep1sg1f0ws4d$.12xpkobd59bq$.dlg@40tude.net...
> 
>> Regardless of the OP's situation or intent, Lemming's motives are
>> admirable.  He's still basically a bastard, but even Homer nods.
> 
> I always thought that he was basically a good guy but the bastard facade was 
> just pervasive?

You've got it wrong, Bill.  Lemming is basically a great guy but the good
guy facade is pervasively bastardly.

Bret
-- 
But I AM a people person, you poor dumb bastards! -- JustBoo

On 28 Apr 2006 19:47:13 -0700, Dosferatu wrote:

> On or about Thu, 27 Apr 2006 14:15:24 +0200, some person or persons unknown
> calling themselves Hadron Quark ", did cause <87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com> to
> appear on my glass typewriter and spake thus:
>>
>>"Erland Andreassen" <wsg@lways-nospam-.online.no> writes:
>>
>>>>> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
>>>>> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>>>>> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>>>>>
>>>>> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
>>>>> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
>>>>> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
>>>>> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>>>>>
>>>>> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
>>>>> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
>>>>> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>>>>> for me to face.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Are they to blame or something? What happened?
>>>
>>> Nothing happend, probably some tosser that got his accounts banned for 
>>> cheating or what not and
>>> try find a way to get back at EVE. If something like this really happend it 
>>> would come out into the
>>> EVE community quite fast, and no such thing have surfaced on the EVE 
>>> grapevine. Don't feed the trolls please ;-)
>>>
>>>
>>
>>It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
>>some truth in it.
>>
> 
> Yes, if you are looking for comfort and love, and a caring shoulder to cry on,
> c.s.i.p.g-space-sim is the place to go.

Good heavens -- do I hear a voice from the glory-days of c.s.i.p.g.s-s?

> Everyone is treated like a decent human being here.

Right.  Well, Pat, it's like this: things have become a bit lax around here
in recent years.  I'd ask Shingen to stop by and restore normalcy -- he
usually does this by telling random posters to piss off -- but he's away at
a Sensitivity Training Seminar this week.  When he gets back, you'll get a
taste of the cold, austere front we usually like to present.

While we're waiting, can I bring you a scone?  Can you stay for drinks?

Bret

On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 21:58:51 -0700, Bret Ripley <ripley@gotsky.com>
wrote:

 I'd ask Shingen to stop by and restore normalcy -- he
>usually does this by telling random posters to piss off -- but he's away at
>a Sensitivity Training Seminar this week.  When he gets back, you'll get a
>taste of the cold, austere front we usually like to present.
>

They kicked me out of that class. They said I was a bad influence,
after I brought in a case a beer and some old Black Sabbath Cds. 

>While we're waiting, can I bring you a scone?  Can you stay for drinks?
>
>Bret

Piss off! Oh wait, were u random? I forget.

On Sat, 29 Apr 2006 17:08:15 GMT, Shingen wrote:

> On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 21:58:51 -0700, Bret Ripley <ripley@gotsky.com>
> wrote:
> 
>  I'd ask Shingen to stop by and restore normalcy -- he
>>usually does this by telling random posters to piss off -- but he's away at
>>a Sensitivity Training Seminar this week.  When he gets back, you'll get a
>>taste of the cold, austere front we usually like to present.
>>
> 
> They kicked me out of that class. They said I was a bad influence,
> after I brought in a case a beer and some old Black Sabbath Cds. 

So, it was pretty much "mission accomplished," then?

>>While we're waiting, can I bring you a scone?  Can you stay for drinks?
>>
>>Bret
> 
> Piss off! Oh wait, were u random?

I am determined to be so.

> I forget.

It's for the best.

Bret

On Sat, 29 Apr 2006 11:50:43 -0700, Bret Ripley <ripley@gotsky.com>
wrote:


>> They kicked me out of that class. They said I was a bad influence,
>> after I brought in a case a beer and some old Black Sabbath Cds. 
>
>So, it was pretty much "mission accomplished," then?
>
Oh fuck..what a bunch of hypocrites! They started talking about how
everyone should "accept" people and "new ideas" and "new cultures" and
all such bullshit.

I walked in with my beer and Sabbath, ready to be sensitive and
relate, and all that, and then the "instructor" got all pissy like an
old women at a bible bazaar. So I took the two best looking women
there, and we went and had some "sensitivity" training of our own. =P

>>>While we're waiting, can I bring you a scone?  Can you stay for drinks?
>>>
>>>Bret
>> 
>> Piss off! Oh wait, were u random?
>
>I am determined to be so.
>
You are an excellent example

>> I forget.
>
>It's for the best.
>

I try.

>Bret

Kono michi shika nai, hidori de aruku.

I wish to apologise for the offence which I might have caused to the 
people of America, based on the comments which I have previously posted 
in this thread. I AM concerned by the foreign policy which is being 
pursued by the American administration. I AM worried about the future of 
this planet now that the "balance of power" represented by the doctrine 
of M.A.D. (mutually assured destruction) has been removed, due to the 
demise of the Soviet Union. And I AM concerned that the American 
administration is using propaganda to misinform the people of America 
about the reasons for its actions. However, I have had contacts with 
Americans while I was playing the MMORPG Eve-online, not just via chat 
boxes but direct via VOIP software such as Ventrilo and MS Teamspeak. 
And from these links I know that there are many people in the U.S. who 
are just as concerned as I am about their country's actions and objectives.

One of the reasons I was so condemnatory about the "Eve-player" posts is 
that I value freedom of speech so highly. So much of the communication 
which all of us need in the modern world is actually controlled by 
corporations which have their own business agenda. We cannot guarantee 
that everything we hear is objectively true. One of the few "unlimited" 
channels that we use is the Internet. Generally speaking, Internet 
communications (and especially newsgroup posts) are free of external 
interference, monitoring, and censorship. If anyone tries to use 
emotional or any other kind of blackmail to subvert the freedom which 
newsgroups enjoy, then that makes me very angry. This is why I made a 
judgement about the "Eve-player" posts and subsequently condemned them.

However, in doing so, I made some comments about "typical Americans". I 
regret those comments, as I now realise that effectively they were 
racist (i.e. based on race/creed/colour/religion/nationality). Although 
there are a large number of Americans who believe that their government 
is following a just and honourable path, there are a growing number who 
are worried that their nation is hell-bent on a policy of world 
domination, and wish that they could change things. This difference of 
opinion obviously makes it invalid to tar all Americans with the same 
brush. To all those of you who don't follow your administration's line, 
I'm sorry.

I hope this makes a start towards making amends.

On or about Fri, 28 Apr 2006 21:58:51 -0700, some person or persons unknown
calling themselves Bret Ripley ", did cause
<w8k5aa36r0ir$.yw95h91ntsa3$.dlg@40tude.net> to appear on my glass typewriter
and spake thus:
>
>On 28 Apr 2006 19:47:13 -0700, Dosferatu wrote:
>
>> On or about Thu, 27 Apr 2006 14:15:24 +0200, some person or persons unknown
>> calling themselves Hadron Quark ", did cause <87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com> to
>> appear on my glass typewriter and spake thus:
>>>
>>>"Erland Andreassen" <wsg@lways-nospam-.online.no> writes:
>>>
>>>>>> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
>>>>>> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>>>>>> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
>>>>>> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
>>>>>> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
>>>>>> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
>>>>>> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
>>>>>> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>>>>>> for me to face.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Are they to blame or something? What happened?
>>>>
>>>> Nothing happend, probably some tosser that got his accounts banned for 
>>>> cheating or what not and
>>>>try find a way to get back at EVE. If something like this really happend it
>>>> would come out into the
>>>> EVE community quite fast, and no such thing have surfaced on the EVE 
>>>> grapevine. Don't feed the trolls please ;-)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
>>>some truth in it.
>>>
>> 
>>Yes, if you are looking for comfort and love, and a caring shoulder to cry on,
>> c.s.i.p.g-space-sim is the place to go.
>
>Good heavens -- do I hear a voice from the glory-days of c.s.i.p.g.s-s?
>
>> Everyone is treated like a decent human being here.
>
>Right.  Well, Pat, it's like this: things have become a bit lax around here
>in recent years.  I'd ask Shingen to stop by and restore normalcy -- he
>usually does this by telling random posters to piss off -- but he's away at
>a Sensitivity Training Seminar this week.  When he gets back, you'll get a
>taste of the cold, austere front we usually like to present.
>

Ever since the brain operashun I have such trouble wtih a keyboard, but
sometimes the nurse helps me.

Who was that nice man who was so helpful to people trying to play his game?
Derwood? Darin?
It was such a good game too, Pongcruiser 1999 I think is was called. All the
best features of combat mixed in with breakout.

Oh, where has derwood gone? and his best buddy Louie, they used to play super
mario go-carts togetehr, if I remember.

And the men in blue suits waving papers, who were they? I can't remember at all
sometimes. . .

>While we're waiting, can I bring you a scone?  Can you stay for drinks?

If you can get it into the tube they feed me with, sure, I'll have what your
having.

>
>Bret


-- 
NewsGuy.Com 30Gb $9.95 Carry Forward and On Demand Bandwidth

On 30 Apr 2006 20:25:35 -0700, Dosferatu wrote:

> On or about Fri, 28 Apr 2006 21:58:51 -0700, some person or persons unknown
> calling themselves Bret Ripley ", did cause
> <w8k5aa36r0ir$.yw95h91ntsa3$.dlg@40tude.net> to appear on my glass typewriter
> and spake thus:
>>
>>On 28 Apr 2006 19:47:13 -0700, Dosferatu wrote:
>>
>>> On or about Thu, 27 Apr 2006 14:15:24 +0200, some person or persons unknown
>>> calling themselves Hadron Quark ", did cause <87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com> to
>>> appear on my glass typewriter and spake thus:
>>>>
>>>>"Erland Andreassen" <wsg@lways-nospam-.online.no> writes:
>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all got
>>>>>>> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>>>>>>> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people will
>>>>>>> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was unfair
>>>>>>> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is JUST
>>>>>>> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to explain
>>>>>>> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But they
>>>>>>> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>>>>>>> for me to face.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are they to blame or something? What happened?
>>>>>
>>>>> Nothing happend, probably some tosser that got his accounts banned for 
>>>>> cheating or what not and
>>>>>try find a way to get back at EVE. If something like this really happend it
>>>>> would come out into the
>>>>> EVE community quite fast, and no such thing have surfaced on the EVE 
>>>>> grapevine. Don't feed the trolls please ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
>>>>some truth in it.
>>>>
>>> 
>>>Yes, if you are looking for comfort and love, and a caring shoulder to cry on,
>>> c.s.i.p.g-space-sim is the place to go.
>>
>>Good heavens -- do I hear a voice from the glory-days of c.s.i.p.g.s-s?
>>
>>> Everyone is treated like a decent human being here.
>>
>>Right.  Well, Pat, it's like this: things have become a bit lax around here
>>in recent years.  I'd ask Shingen to stop by and restore normalcy -- he
>>usually does this by telling random posters to piss off -- but he's away at
>>a Sensitivity Training Seminar this week.  When he gets back, you'll get a
>>taste of the cold, austere front we usually like to present.
>>
> 
> Ever since the brain operashun I have such trouble wtih a keyboard, but
> sometimes the nurse helps me.

Please give Nurse Ratched my warmest regards.

> Who was that nice man who was so helpful to people trying to play his game?
> Derwood? Darin?
> It was such a good game too, Pongcruiser 1999 I think is was called. All the
> best features of combat mixed in with breakout.
> 
> Oh, where has derwood gone? and his best buddy Louie,

Snoopy Louie?  He eloped with Joe@bsfilter, but it didn't last.  Overcome
by his love for animals, he ran away to pursue his dream of becoming a
veterinary anesthetist.  Or a rodeo clown.  I forget which.

> they used to play super
> mario go-carts togetehr, if I remember.
> 
> And the men in blue suits waving papers, who were they? I can't remember at all
> sometimes. . .

There is no pain you are receding
A distant ship smoke on the horizon

>>While we're waiting, can I bring you a scone?  Can you stay for drinks?
> 
> If you can get it into the tube they feed me with, sure, I'll have what your
> having.

Okay, but you may be happier with what Shin's having.

Bret

On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 20:14:40 -0700, Bret Ripley wrote:

> But I AM a people person, you poor dumb bastards! -- JustBoo

Thanks for the e-mail, JB.

My reply via e-mail bounced: it is possible that your HAL-9000 mail server
doesn't want me to write to you.  I'm going to try get around HAL's filter
by disguising my message as porn spam; be sure to click on all the links or
you may miss my message.

Bret

"Dosferatu" <dosferatu_pjl@yahoo.com> wrote in message 
news:e33v3f01eo1@drn.newsguy.com...
> On or about Fri, 28 Apr 2006 21:58:51 -0700, some person or persons 
> unknown
> calling themselves Bret Ripley ", did cause
> <w8k5aa36r0ir$.yw95h91ntsa3$.dlg@40tude.net> to appear on my glass 
> typewriter
> and spake thus:
>>
>>On 28 Apr 2006 19:47:13 -0700, Dosferatu wrote:
>>
>>> On or about Thu, 27 Apr 2006 14:15:24 +0200, some person or persons 
>>> unknown
>>> calling themselves Hadron Quark ", did cause <87wtdb9pur.fsf@gmail.com> 
>>> to
>>> appear on my glass typewriter and spake thus:
>>>>
>>>>"Erland Andreassen" <wsg@lways-nospam-.online.no> writes:
>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, it happened, and yes I failed miserably as his father. We all 
>>>>>>> got
>>>>>>> into the game together as a family, and now, what at one time seemed
>>>>>>> like a great idea, is so horrible to me I can hardly face it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The reason I posted it here is I am hoping that some decent people 
>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>> actually, eventually, do something about this. What happened was 
>>>>>>> unfair
>>>>>>> and wrong. Yes, it was a lot my fault but at the same time, Eve is 
>>>>>>> JUST
>>>>>>> a game afterall. Do we have to be so mean about it?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> EVE is all fouled up. The GM's don't listen to you. I tried to 
>>>>>>> explain
>>>>>>> that we don't have accounts on Ebay nor do we buy stuff there. But 
>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>> dont' care. They don't care that my son died. It's just too horrible
>>>>>>> for me to face.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are they to blame or something? What happened?
>>>>>
>>>>> Nothing happend, probably some tosser that got his accounts banned for
>>>>> cheating or what not and
>>>>>try find a way to get back at EVE. If something like this really 
>>>>>happend it
>>>>> would come out into the
>>>>> EVE community quite fast, and no such thing have surfaced on the EVE
>>>>> grapevine. Don't feed the trolls please ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>It was my first thought but didnt want to be too rude in case there was
>>>>some truth in it.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Yes, if you are looking for comfort and love, and a caring shoulder to 
>>>cry on,
>>> c.s.i.p.g-space-sim is the place to go.
>>
>>Good heavens -- do I hear a voice from the glory-days of c.s.i.p.g.s-s?
>>
>>> Everyone is treated like a decent human being here.
>>
>>Right.  Well, Pat, it's like this: things have become a bit lax around 
>>here
>>in recent years.  I'd ask Shingen to stop by and restore normalcy -- he
>>usually does this by telling random posters to piss off -- but he's away 
>>at
>>a Sensitivity Training Seminar this week.  When he gets back, you'll get a
>>taste of the cold, austere front we usually like to present.
>>
>
> Ever since the brain operashun I have such trouble wtih a keyboard, but
> sometimes the nurse helps me.
>
> Who was that nice man who was so helpful to people trying to play his 
> game?
> Derwood? Darin?
> It was such a good game too, Pongcruiser 1999 I think is was called. All 
> the
> best features of combat mixed in with breakout.
>
> Oh, where has derwood gone? and his best buddy Louie, they used to play 
> super
> mario go-carts togetehr, if I remember.
>
> And the men in blue suits waving papers, who were they? I can't remember 
> at all
> sometimes. . .
>
>>While we're waiting, can I bring you a scone?  Can you stay for drinks?
>
> If you can get it into the tube they feed me with, sure, I'll have what 
> your
> having.

Dear Paul, I'm so pleased that your mind is getting sharper everyday, just 
like mine. Although I would like to remind you that Derwood was lying about 
something. If I remember correctly, he was lying about being part of the 
human race or something. 

Nice one Keith! Someone using your account? ;-)

CC (who is not American, and agrees with your views on American foreign
policy and free speech)

On Mon, 01 May 2006 03:02:35 GMT, KeithB <nospam@spambin.net> wrote:

Hmm, it *looks* like an apology, but ...

>I wish to apologise for the offence which I might have caused to the 
>people of America, based on the comments which I have previously posted 
>in this thread. I AM concerned by the foreign policy which is being 
>pursued by the American administration. I AM worried about the future of 
>this planet now that the "balance of power" represented by the doctrine 
>of M.A.D. (mutually assured destruction) has been removed, due to the 
>demise of the Soviet Union. And I AM concerned that the American 
>administration is using propaganda to misinform the people of America 
>about the reasons for its actions. However, I have had contacts with 
>Americans while I was playing the MMORPG Eve-online, not just via chat 
>boxes but direct via VOIP software such as Ventrilo and MS Teamspeak. 
>And from these links I know that there are many people in the U.S. who 
>are just as concerned as I am about their country's actions and objectives.

Translation: American Foreign Policy sucks.

Hint: UK Foreign Policy sucks too.

>One of the reasons I was so condemnatory about the "Eve-player" posts is 
>that I value freedom of speech so highly. So much of the communication 
>which all of us need in the modern world is actually controlled by 
>corporations which have their own business agenda. We cannot guarantee 
>that everything we hear is objectively true. One of the few "unlimited" 
>channels that we use is the Internet. Generally speaking, Internet 
>communications (and especially newsgroup posts) are free of external 
>interference, monitoring, and censorship. If anyone tries to use 
>emotional or any other kind of blackmail to subvert the freedom which 
>newsgroups enjoy, then that makes me very angry. This is why I made a 
>judgement about the "Eve-player" posts and subsequently condemned them.

Translation: I want to avoid further revealing myself as a shallow,
boring twat with no empathy for my fellow humans and now I need to
find a a way to justify it.  All I have to do is play the "freedom of
speech" card and that will fool those dumb Americans into thinking I'm
a good guy after all.

Hint: Abraham Lincoln was American (You can fool some of the people
all of the time, etc.)

>However, in doing so, I made some comments about "typical Americans". I 
>regret those comments, as I now realise that effectively they were 
>racist (i.e. based on race/creed/colour/religion/nationality). Although 
>there are a large number of Americans who believe that their government 
>is following a just and honourable path, there are a growing number who 
>are worried that their nation is hell-bent on a policy of world 
>domination, and wish that they could change things. This difference of 
>opinion obviously makes it invalid to tar all Americans with the same 
>brush. To all those of you who don't follow your administration's line, 
>I'm sorry.

Translation: I found yet another excuse to rehearse my personal hobby
horse (AKA American Foreign Policy Sucks v All Americans Are Morons)
and I now realise I made an arse of myself again.

Hint: Learn to think before you post.

>I hope this makes a start towards making amends.

*BING!*

Hint: *BING!*

Lemming
-- 
Curiosity *may* have killed Schrodinger's cat.

Lemming wrote:
> On Mon, 01 May 2006 03:02:35 GMT, KeithB <nospam@spambin.net> wrote:
>
> Hmm, it *looks* like an apology, but ...
>
[snip]
> Translation: American Foreign Policy sucks.
>
> Hint: UK Foreign Policy sucks too.

Dude, that's because UK foreign policy is determined by America! While
Tony Blair is leader, at least. There was an interesting article this
weekend about what would happen to UK foreign policy under different
successors. Jack Straw is probably the best bet for breaking out of the
poodle mentality.

[snip]

> Translation: I want to avoid further revealing myself as a shallow,
> boring twat with no empathy for my fellow humans and now I need to
> find a a way to justify it.  All I have to do is play the "freedom of
> speech" card and that will fool those dumb Americans into thinking I'm
> a good guy after all.

LoL! That is quite funny, if a bit harsh.

[snip]

> Translation: I found yet another excuse to rehearse my personal hobby
> horse (AKA American Foreign Policy Sucks v All Americans Are Morons)
> and I now realise I made an arse of myself again.

I just had this exact issue on alt.games.diablo2. Is someone who
doesn't like the policies of the Israeli government an anti-semite? I
think not.

It is painfully easy to sound like you're saying "americans are morons"
when you mean to say "America is ruled by very bad people pursuing very
bad policies". Really and truly, most of us only mean the latter. It's
just that it gets us really steamed and we start to sound like we're
slating individual americans, when most of them don't deserve it. 

CC

On 2 May 2006 08:53:46 -0700, "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk>
wrote:

>Lemming wrote:
>> On Mon, 01 May 2006 03:02:35 GMT, KeithB <nospam@spambin.net> wrote:
>>
>> Hmm, it *looks* like an apology, but ...
>>
>[snip]
>> Translation: American Foreign Policy sucks.
>>
>> Hint: UK Foreign Policy sucks too.
>
>Dude, that's because UK foreign policy is determined by America! While
>Tony Blair is leader, at least. There was an interesting article this
>weekend about what would happen to UK foreign policy under different
>successors. Jack Straw is probably the best bet for breaking out of the
>poodle mentality.
>
>[snip]
>
>> Translation: I want to avoid further revealing myself as a shallow,
>> boring twat with no empathy for my fellow humans and now I need to
>> find a a way to justify it.  All I have to do is play the "freedom of
>> speech" card and that will fool those dumb Americans into thinking I'm
>> a good guy after all.
>
>LoL! That is quite funny, if a bit harsh.
>
>[snip]
>
>> Translation: I found yet another excuse to rehearse my personal hobby
>> horse (AKA American Foreign Policy Sucks v All Americans Are Morons)
>> and I now realise I made an arse of myself again.
>
>I just had this exact issue on alt.games.diablo2. Is someone who
>doesn't like the policies of the Israeli government an anti-semite? I
>think not.
>
>It is painfully easy to sound like you're saying "americans are morons"
>when you mean to say "America is ruled by very bad people pursuing very
>bad policies". Really and truly, most of us only mean the latter. It's
>just that it gets us really steamed and we start to sound like we're
>slating individual americans, when most of them don't deserve it. 

We Americans are easily offended.

Lemming
-- 
Curiosity *may* have killed Schrodinger's cat.

"magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message 
news:1146585226.050740.7420@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
...
> It is painfully easy to sound like you're saying "americans are morons"
> when you mean to say "America is ruled by very bad people pursuing very
> bad policies". Really and truly, most of us only mean the latter. It's
> just that it gets us really steamed and we start to sound like we're
> slating individual americans, when most of them don't deserve it.

Well this past election most did vote for Bush although the majority was by 
the slimmest of margins and his popularity rating has taken a nose dive as 
more Americans are realizing that he's a dangerous self-serving foolish 
incompetent president.

I for one appreciate that the UK is rooting for the USA. It is nice when the 
schoolyard bully has someone that is on their side, at least from the 
bully's point of view. This is the magic of Bush in a nutchell. He's managed 
to turn the USA from the image of victim-trying-to-prevent-atrocities into 
the image of a schoolyard-bully-extorting-lunch-money. 

"Bill Huffman" <bhuffma1@san.rr.com> wrote in message 
news:_C16g.4281$yM.3853@tornado.socal.rr.com...
>
> "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message 
> news:1146585226.050740.7420@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> ...
>> It is painfully easy to sound like you're saying "americans are morons"
>> when you mean to say "America is ruled by very bad people pursuing very
>> bad policies". Really and truly, most of us only mean the latter. It's
>> just that it gets us really steamed and we start to sound like we're
>> slating individual americans, when most of them don't deserve it.
>
> Well this past election most did vote for Bush

Most of the registered voters who bothered to vote, anyway. 

Bill Huffman wrote:
> I for one appreciate that the UK is rooting for the USA. It is nice when the
> schoolyard bully has someone that is on their side, at least from the
> bully's point of view. This is the magic of Bush in a nutchell. He's managed
> to turn the USA from the image of victim-trying-to-prevent-atrocities into
> the image of a schoolyard-bully-extorting-lunch-money.

Heh, that's about the size of it. I'd go so far as to say that the
break-up of the Soviet Union was actually a disaster for the USA.
Before that, you could all just point and say "look, they're the Evil
Empire, we must oppose them", and the rest of the world turned a blind
eye to all the destabilisation and other stuff going on elsewhere in
the world. Now there's no Evil Empire, US foreign policy is under much
greater scrutiny.

Nowadays it's unfortunate that you have such a bunch of greedy assholes
in charge, but to be fair to Dubya, the US wasn't exactly "victim
trying to prevent atrocities" when he took over. There was a gradual
decline over the preceding half century from that! Still, there are
loads of really cool americans (none of whom have voted republican in
the past 30 years).

It's uncanny how much the political situation in the UK is
approximating that in the US. Our Labour party, once a genuine force
for socialism and public good, is now indistinguishable from our
Conservative party, and as bad as the US Democrats in terms of helping
the rich more than the poor. There is really no alternative to the
right wing in either country. Big business rules, and everything else -
poor people, the environment, justice, healthcare, education - can go
to hell. 

Ho hum. Off to slash wrists, or move to Sweden.

CC

On Wed, 03 May 2006 12:46:50 GMT, "Bill Huffman" <bhuffma1@san.rr.com>
wrote:

>more Americans are realizing that he's a dangerous self-serving foolish 
>incompetent president.

Dangerous? Self-serving? Foolish? Incompetent? Sounds like he'd fit in
perfectly on Usenet.

"magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message 
news:1146662151.529458.109930@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Bill Huffman wrote:
>> I for one appreciate that the UK is rooting for the USA. It is nice when 
>> the
>> schoolyard bully has someone that is on their side, at least from the
>> bully's point of view. This is the magic of Bush in a nutchell. He's 
>> managed
>> to turn the USA from the image of victim-trying-to-prevent-atrocities 
>> into
>> the image of a schoolyard-bully-extorting-lunch-money.
>
> Heh, that's about the size of it. I'd go so far as to say that the
> break-up of the Soviet Union was actually a disaster for the USA.
> Before that, you could all just point and say "look, they're the Evil
> Empire, we must oppose them", and the rest of the world turned a blind
> eye to all the destabilisation and other stuff going on elsewhere in
> the world. Now there's no Evil Empire, US foreign policy is under much
> greater scrutiny.
>
> Nowadays it's unfortunate that you have such a bunch of greedy assholes
> in charge, but to be fair to Dubya, the US wasn't exactly "victim
> trying to prevent atrocities" when he took over. There was a gradual
> decline over the preceding half century from that! Still, there are
> loads of really cool americans (none of whom have voted republican in
> the past 30 years).

I'm not going to argue against that more global higher level observation 
but, I was referring to the image of the USA for those few months directly 
after September 11, 2001. Those few months where the USA might have still 
have been the schoolyard bully at heart but the support for the USA came 
from almost everyone else in the schoolyard. 

On 3 May 2006 06:15:51 -0700, "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk>
wrote:

>Heh, that's about the size of it. I'd go so far as to say that the
>break-up of the Soviet Union was actually a disaster for the USA.

I've been on usenet for over 12 years and the statement above is
without a doubt, one of the most wantonly ignorant, low IQ, beyond
idiotic, "you couldn't be more stoopid", insane things I've read in
all that time. And brother that's saying something.

I hope you have not cursed the world with your low IQ seed by
impregnating a female yet.

[rest of ignorant drivel snipped]

Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of 
ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent 
virtue is the equal sharing of misery.
- Winston Churchill

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it 
will eat him last. - Winston Churchill 

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most 
of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if 
nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill 

On Wed, 03 May 2006 12:46:50 GMT, Bill Huffman wrote:

> "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message 
> news:1146585226.050740.7420@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> ...
>> It is painfully easy to sound like you're saying "americans are morons"
>> when you mean to say "America is ruled by very bad people pursuing very
>> bad policies". Really and truly, most of us only mean the latter. It's
>> just that it gets us really steamed and we start to sound like we're
>> slating individual americans, when most of them don't deserve it.
> 
> Well this past election most did vote for Bush although the majority was by 
> the slimmest of margins and his popularity rating has taken a nose dive as 
> more Americans are realizing that he's a dangerous self-serving foolish 
> incompetent president.

Did you see Stephen Colbert roast Dubya, while taking swipes at the lapdog
Washington Press along the way?  Colbert had a captive audience, and he
didn't waste the opportunity.

Video available here:

http://www.vastmoderateconspiracy.com/wp-images/colbert/colbert.wmv

Transcript available here:

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2006/4/30/1441/59811

A lot of the humor will be lost on those unfamiliar with American politics,
but it may be an eye-opener for those who have this idea that Americans are
a gang of goose-stepping automatons.

Out of curiosity: would anything like the above ever happen to Tony Blair?

> I for one appreciate that the UK is rooting for the USA.

Heh.  You're a canny one, Bill.

Put another way, judging Americans based on the actions of the US President
is every bit as risible as judging all Brits based on the pronouncements of
whomever happens to be receiving mail at 10 Downing Street.

Bret

On Wed, 03 May 2006 09:24:57 -0500, gray.wizard@moria.mines wrote:

>On Wed, 03 May 2006 12:46:50 GMT, "Bill Huffman" <bhuffma1@san.rr.com>
>wrote:
>
>>more Americans are realizing that he's a dangerous self-serving foolish 
>>incompetent president.
>
>Dangerous? Self-serving? Foolish? Incompetent? Sounds like he'd fit in
>perfectly on Usenet.
hehe. I wonder if he's a Derek fanboi. =P

Bill Huffman wrote:
> "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
> > Bill Huffman wrote:

> >> I for one appreciate that the UK is rooting for the USA. It is nice when
> >> the
> >> schoolyard bully has someone that is on their side, at least from the
> >> bully's point of view. This is the magic of Bush in a nutchell. He's
> >> managed
> >> to turn the USA from the image of victim-trying-to-prevent-atrocities
> >> into
> >> the image of a schoolyard-bully-extorting-lunch-money.
> >
> > Heh, that's about the size of it. I'd go so far as to say that the
> > break-up of the Soviet Union was actually a disaster for the USA.
> > Before that, you could all just point and say "look, they're the Evil
> > Empire, we must oppose them", and the rest of the world turned a blind
> > eye to all the destabilisation and other stuff going on elsewhere in
> > the world. Now there's no Evil Empire, US foreign policy is under much
> > greater scrutiny.
> >
> > Nowadays it's unfortunate that you have such a bunch of greedy assholes
> > in charge, but to be fair to Dubya, the US wasn't exactly "victim
> > trying to prevent atrocities" when he took over. There was a gradual
> > decline over the preceding half century from that! Still, there are
> > loads of really cool americans (none of whom have voted republican in
> > the past 30 years).
>
> I'm not going to argue against that more global higher level observation
> but, I was referring to the image of the USA for those few months directly
> after September 11, 2001. Those few months where the USA might have still
> have been the schoolyard bully at heart but the support for the USA came
> from almost everyone else in the schoolyard.

Ah, I get it. Yes, I agree with that completely - sorry to have
misunderstood you.

CC

JustBoo wrote:
> On 3 May 2006 06:15:51 -0700, "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
> >Heh, that's about the size of it. I'd go so far as to say that the
> >break-up of the Soviet Union was actually a disaster for the USA.
>
> I've been on usenet for over 12 years and the statement above is
> without a doubt, one of the most wantonly ignorant, low IQ, beyond
> idiotic, "you couldn't be more stoopid", insane things I've read in
> all that time. And brother that's saying something.

Thank you. I've been on usenet for about 15 years and that's the best
insult I've received (though sadly not quite the best I've ever seen).
I think "wantonly ignorant" was the high point. It's a shame that you
let yourself down with the Churchill quotes. It reveals you as
considerably less intelligent than you would otherwise seem, and hints
(though this could be wrong) that the socialist/left-leaning slant of
my post riles you considerably more than the not-entirely-serious
statement you quoted above. (That could just be a coincidence, since
Churchill was so rabidly anti-left, as only a former socialist could
be.)

Churchill was a bit like the late Queen Mother - both were almost
perfect for the role they were in at the time, but thoroughly
unpleasant people. Churchill was a canny politician and an incredibly
gifted orator, but he was a mediocre leader at best, and quite a bad
one when you factor in the alcoholism.
 
CC

Bret Ripley wrote:
> On Wed, 03 May 2006 12:46:50 GMT, Bill Huffman wrote:
> > "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
> > ...
> >> It is painfully easy to sound like you're saying "americans are morons"
> >> when you mean to say "America is ruled by very bad people pursuing very
> >> bad policies". Really and truly, most of us only mean the latter. It's
> >> just that it gets us really steamed and we start to sound like we're
> >> slating individual americans, when most of them don't deserve it.
> >
> > Well this past election most did vote for Bush although the majority was by
> > the slimmest of margins and his popularity rating has taken a nose dive as
> > more Americans are realizing that he's a dangerous self-serving foolish
> > incompetent president.
>
> Did you see Stephen Colbert roast Dubya, while taking swipes at the lapdog
> Washington Press along the way?  Colbert had a captive audience, and he
> didn't waste the opportunity.

[links]

> A lot of the humor will be lost on those unfamiliar with American politics,
> but it may be an eye-opener for those who have this idea that Americans are
> a gang of goose-stepping automatons.

Thank you - it was a great read. I probably missed about half the gags,
but it was still great. (Having watched a few episodes of the West
Wing, I knew americans were capable of appreciating incisive swipes at
their own administration!)

> Out of curiosity: would anything like the above ever happen to Tony Blair?

Yes - last September there was a big hoo-hah when a BBC journalist did
something similar at a private function (I've tried to find a
transcript but can't - google for 'John Humphrys speech' and it turns
up loads of articles about it), but it was slightly nastier and less
funny.

> Put another way, judging Americans based on the actions of the US President
> is every bit as risible as judging all Brits based on the pronouncements of
> whomever happens to be receiving mail at 10 Downing Street.

Agreed. So it should be easy to discern whether someone is really
"anti-american" or just slagging off the Bush administration.

CC

P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?

"magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message 
news:1146754633.077732.62490@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
> watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
> about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
> does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
> of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?

Just a guess but might it have to do with the two countries in the 
nineteen-fifties, one of which was obsessing about hygiene and the other 
rebuilding from WWII? 

magnate wrote:
>
> P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
> watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
> about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
> does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
> of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?
>

You have to blame Mike Myers of  Austin Powers who started all things.
Though, he make it popular in some of his skits while he was with
Saturday Night Life.

In article <1146761518.935167.126160@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>, 
linch9@gmail.com says...
> magnate wrote:
> >
> > P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
> > watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
> > about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
> > does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
> > of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?
> > 
> You have to blame Mike Myers of  Austin Powers who started all things.
> Though, he make it popular in some of his skits while he was with
> Saturday Night Life.

Whatever started it, it wasn't Mike Myers.

I'd guess it goes back to the 50s.  Probably British dental care was 
not great, whereas USians started getting their teeth whitened and 
straightened to a degree which Rightpondians found as freakish and 
unnatural as silicone tits.  So both sides were inclined to rib the 
other about it.

- Gerry Quinn

On 4 May 2006 07:57:13 -0700, magnate wrote:

> Bret Ripley wrote:
>> On Wed, 03 May 2006 12:46:50 GMT, Bill Huffman wrote:
>>> "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> It is painfully easy to sound like you're saying "americans are morons"
>>>> when you mean to say "America is ruled by very bad people pursuing very
>>>> bad policies". Really and truly, most of us only mean the latter. It's
>>>> just that it gets us really steamed and we start to sound like we're
>>>> slating individual americans, when most of them don't deserve it.
>>>
>>> Well this past election most did vote for Bush although the majority was by
>>> the slimmest of margins and his popularity rating has taken a nose dive as
>>> more Americans are realizing that he's a dangerous self-serving foolish
>>> incompetent president.
>>
>> Did you see Stephen Colbert roast Dubya, while taking swipes at the lapdog
>> Washington Press along the way?  Colbert had a captive audience, and he
>> didn't waste the opportunity.
> 
> [links]
> 
>> A lot of the humor will be lost on those unfamiliar with American politics,
>> but it may be an eye-opener for those who have this idea that Americans are
>> a gang of goose-stepping automatons.
> 
> Thank you - it was a great read. I probably missed about half the gags,
> but it was still great. (Having watched a few episodes of the West
> Wing, I knew americans were capable of appreciating incisive swipes at
> their own administration!)

Sure -- it just doesn't tend to happen when the big guy and several of his
minions are sitting just a few feet away, unable to interrupt or respond.

>> Out of curiosity: would anything like the above ever happen to Tony Blair?
> 
> Yes - last September there was a big hoo-hah when a BBC journalist did
> something similar at a private function (I've tried to find a
> transcript but can't - google for 'John Humphrys speech' and it turns
> up loads of articles about it), but it was slightly nastier and less
> funny.

Thanks -- I'll take a look for it.

In years past I used to watch the House of Commons "Questions for the Prime
Minister" -- it was remarkable how nasty  those sessions could become.
That Neil Kinnock could be a ruthless bastard!
 
>> Put another way, judging Americans based on the actions of the US President
>> is every bit as risible as judging all Brits based on the pronouncements of
>> whomever happens to be receiving mail at 10 Downing Street.
> 
> Agreed. So it should be easy to discern whether someone is really
> "anti-american" or just slagging off the Bush administration.

You would think so.  However, it is possible for the distinction to be less
clear than it should.  Some people seem to have difficulty sorting out
their own prejudices.

> CC
> 
> P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
> watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
> about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
> does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
> of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?

It was also a prominent gag in the first Austin Powers film.

I'm not really sure of it's origin, but it is possible that this particular
joke is based on a misperception stemming from differences between American
film and television actors and their British counterparts.

In general, American actors and actresses have ridiculously perfect teeth.
Perhaps it has changed in recent years, but in the past British actors
didn't necessarily bother to have dental imperfections corrected.  For
example, I recently watched an old TV show (I think it was "The Avengers",
though it may have been "The Saint") which featured Peter Bowles.  Now, Mr.
Bowles did not have horrible teeth -- but (being a shallow American) I
couldn't help noticing that they weren't perfect, either: IIRC, he had a
tooth that appeared to be slightly rotated, creating the appearance of a
slight gap.  You don't tend to see that sort of thing with American actors.

So, if my theory is correct, the "bad teeth" gag is based on the American
presumption that, for whatever reason, screen actors and actresses
typically have perfect teeth.  Therefore, if the somewhat-normal looking
teeth of many British actors passes for "perfect" in Britain, then the
average Brit must possess poor teeth.

That's my silly theory, anyway.  And yes, I know the whole "bad teeth"
thing isn't true.

Cheers,

Bret

On Thu, 4 May 2006 10:17:18 -0500, Middlebrow wrote:

> "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message 
> news:1146754633.077732.62490@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>> P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
>> watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
>> about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
>> does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
>> of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?
> 
> Just a guess but might it have to do with the two countries in the 
> nineteen-fifties, one of which was obsessing about hygiene 

Not only hygiene: we were also obsessing about communism and the threat of
imminent nuclear destruction.  One finds that one wishes to put on a good
face when one is about to be vaporized.

> and the other rebuilding from WWII?

On a related note: I recently read about London's 1952-53 "flu epidemic."
A nasty business, that.

Bret

Gerry Quinn <gerryq@DELETETHISindigo.ie> writes:

> In article <1146761518.935167.126160@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>, 
> linch9@gmail.com says...
>> magnate wrote:
>> >
>> > P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
>> > watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
>> > about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
>> > does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
>> > of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?
>> > 
>> You have to blame Mike Myers of  Austin Powers who started all things.
>> Though, he make it popular in some of his skits while he was with
>> Saturday Night Life.
>
> Whatever started it, it wasn't Mike Myers.
>

I always thought it was more the Irish who were mocked for the worst
teeth, although the UK comes a very close second.

"Hadron Quark" <hadronquark@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:87hd45fyfr.fsf@gmail.com...

> I always thought it was more the Irish who were mocked for the worst
> teeth, although the UK comes a very close second.

Drinkin' and fightin'll do that to yeh. 

Bret Ripley <ripley@gotsky.com> looked up from reading the entrails of
the porn spammer to utter  "The Augury is good, the signs say:

>On Thu, 4 May 2006 10:17:18 -0500, Middlebrow wrote:
>
>> "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message 
>> news:1146754633.077732.62490@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>>> P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
>>> watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
>>> about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
>>> does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
>>> of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?
>> 
>> Just a guess but might it have to do with the two countries in the 
>> nineteen-fifties, one of which was obsessing about hygiene 
>
>Not only hygiene: we were also obsessing about communism and the threat of
>imminent nuclear destruction.  One finds that one wishes to put on a good
>face when one is about to be vaporized.

Stop, Drop and Cover, but don't forget to brush?

Xocyll
-- 
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr

Bret Ripley wrote:
> On 4 May 2006 07:57:13 -0700, magnate wrote:
> > Bret Ripley wrote:
> >> On Wed, 03 May 2006 12:46:50 GMT, Bill Huffman wrote:
> >>> "magnate" <chrisc@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
> >>> ...
> >>>> It is painfully easy to sound like you're saying "americans are morons"
> >>>> when you mean to say "America is ruled by very bad people pursuing very
> >>>> bad policies". Really and truly, most of us only mean the latter. It's
> >>>> just that it gets us really steamed and we start to sound like we're
> >>>> slating individual americans, when most of them don't deserve it.
> >>>
> >>> Well this past election most did vote for Bush although the majority was by
> >>> the slimmest of margins and his popularity rating has taken a nose dive as
> >>> more Americans are realizing that he's a dangerous self-serving foolish
> >>> incompetent president.
> >>
> >> Did you see Stephen Colbert roast Dubya, while taking swipes at the lapdog
> >> Washington Press along the way?  Colbert had a captive audience, and he
> >> didn't waste the opportunity.
> >
> > [links]
> >
> >> A lot of the humor will be lost on those unfamiliar with American politics,
> >> but it may be an eye-opener for those who have this idea that Americans are
> >> a gang of goose-stepping automatons.
> >
> > Thank you - it was a great read. I probably missed about half the gags,
> > but it was still great. (Having watched a few episodes of the West
> > Wing, I knew americans were capable of appreciating incisive swipes at
> > their own administration!)
>
> Sure -- it just doesn't tend to happen when the big guy and several of his
> minions are sitting just a few feet away, unable to interrupt or respond.

I couldn't work out whether he was actually present or not - one of the
early gags seemed to hint that he wasn't. It is astonishingly bold if
he was!

> In years past I used to watch the House of Commons "Questions for the Prime
> Minister" -- it was remarkable how nasty  those sessions could become.
> That Neil Kinnock could be a ruthless bastard!

Next Wednesday at noon (GMT+1), go to www.parliamentlive.tv

PMQs is still the high point of UK parliamentary theatre. Sadly you've
just missed Michael Howard, the previous opposition leader - he and
Blair made great comedy. The new guy (David "Dave" Cameron) is too
nice, though he did apparently throw a wobbly last week. The next few
Wednesdays should be really interesting - Blair suffered massive losses
in yesterday's local elections, and his deputy has very recently been
exposed as having an affair with a secretary. The government is really
on the ropes - the BNP (ultra-right party) doubled their seats
yesterday. Scary.

> >> Put another way, judging Americans based on the actions of the US President
> >> is every bit as risible as judging all Brits based on the pronouncements of
> >> whomever happens to be receiving mail at 10 Downing Street.
> >
> > Agreed. So it should be easy to discern whether someone is really
> > "anti-american" or just slagging off the Bush administration.
>
> You would think so.  However, it is possible for the distinction to be less
> clear than it should.  Some people seem to have difficulty sorting out
> their own prejudices.

Agreed again. I know I do, and I see it often in others too.

> > P.S. What's the origin of the thing about Brits having bad teeth? I was
> > watching Family Guy on DVD and there's a hysterically funny episode
> > about that. It's been in the Simpsons too, and other comedy - where
> > does it come from?? I mean, why are we lampooned for our teeth instead
> > of greasy hair, bandy legs or any other physical impairment?
>
> It was also a prominent gag in the first Austin Powers film.
>
> I'm not really sure of it's origin, but it is possible that this particular
> joke is based on a misperception stemming from differences between American
> film and television actors and their British counterparts.

I like your actors theory, but I think I'm probably leaning towards the
British indifference to cosmetic surgery being at the root of it. We're
catching up now, but you guys are 40 or 50 years ahead of us. My wife
watches those awful "extreme makeover" shows, and has already said
half-seriously that she wants a butt lift when she hits 30 ...

Of course, that pretty much *is* your theory, since actors are where
the differences would be most widely noticeable. 

CC