🚀 go-pugleaf

John Levine <jo...@taugh.com> writes:
>While tidying up my bookshelf I found an old copy of
>"Time-Shared Computer Languages" which discussed a bunch
>of languages available on-line in 1973.
>
>One of them was JOSS, first implemented on the vacuum tube Johnniac,
>then reimplemented on the PDP-6, and available on the PDP-10 where DEC
>called it AID.  A cut down version was available on the PDP-8 as
>FOCAL.  I think it had a lot of influence on Basic, both in that
>program lines were numbered and statements started with keywords like
>Let.  The numerically inclined admired its correctly rounded ten digit
>decimal arithmetic, so sqrt(3)*sqrt(3) was 3, not 2.9999999999996.
>
>Are there any versions of JOSS still around?  I suppose I could fire
>up a PDP-10 simulator and look for a copy of AID but I was hoping for
>something less retro.

TSS-8.24 on SIMH has a focal interpreter.

One thing about JOSS is that (unlike FOCAL, which was conventional in 
using normal binary floating-point in software, like most versions of BASIC) it used a binary power of ten exponent with a binary integer mantissa.
Like Intel processors use today for decimal floating-point.

John Levine <jo...@taugh.com> wrote:
> While tidying up my bookshelf I found an old copy of
> "Time-Shared Computer Languages" which discussed a bunch
> of languages available on-line in 1973.
> 
> One of them was JOSS, first implemented on the vacuum tube Johnniac,
> then reimplemented on the PDP-6, and available on the PDP-10 where DEC
> called it AID.  A cut down version was available on the PDP-8 as
> FOCAL.  

Didn't know the relationship, thanks.

> I think it had a lot of influence on Basic, both in that
> program lines were numbered and statements started with keywords like
> Let.  The numerically inclined admired its correctly rounded ten digit
> decimal arithmetic, so sqrt(3)*sqrt(3) was 3, not 2.9999999999996.
> 
> Are there any versions of JOSS still around?  I suppose I could fire
> up a PDP-10 simulator and look for a copy of AID but I was hoping for
> something less retro.
> 

PDP-10 also had CPL (I believe it was called), a conversational version of
PL/I. I'd like to see that also. I think one of the systems at the LCM has
it, don't know if they have source, but I haven't had time to re-learn
enough TOPS-10 or TOPS-20 to check it out.

-- 
Pete

The Dec manual for FOCAL said it was inspired by JOSS, not that it was a version of JOSS.

On Tuesday, May 1, 2018 at 3:40:55 PM UTC-4, John Levine wrote:

> One of them was JOSS, first implemented on the vacuum tube Johnniac,

Wikipedia is your friend:

Joss Ackland (born 1928), British actor
Joss Ambler (1900–1959), Australian-born British film and television actor
Joss Christensen (born 1991), American freestyle skier and 2014 Olympic gold medalist
Joss Fritz (c. 1470-c. 1525), insurgent in Germany
Joss Labadie (born 1990), English footballer
Joss McKinley (born 1981) English photographic artist
Joss Naylor, (born 1936), English fell runner
Joss Whedon (born 1964), American screenwriter, film and television director and producer, television series creator, comic book author and composer
George (Duala king) or Joss, a late 18th-century king of the Duala people of Cameroon
Joss Stirling, a pen name of British novelist Julia Golding (born 1969)
Joss Stone (born 1987), stage name of British female soul singer, songwriter and actress Joscelyn Eve Stoker

You probably want this (creator of B/VS).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joss_Whedon
or this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JOSS

On Tuesday, May 1, 2018 at 3:40:55 PM UTC-4, John Levine wrote:
> While tidying up my bookshelf I found an old copy of
> "Time-Shared Computer Languages" which discussed a bunch
> of languages available on-line in 1973.
> 
> One of them was JOSS, first implemented on the vacuum tube Johnniac,
> then reimplemented on the PDP-6, and available on the PDP-10 where DEC
> called it AID.  A cut down version was available on the PDP-8 as
> FOCAL.  I think it had a lot of influence on Basic, both in that
> program lines were numbered and statements started with keywords like
> Let.  The numerically inclined admired its correctly rounded ten digit
> decimal arithmetic, so sqrt(3)*sqrt(3) was 3, not 2.9999999999996.
> 
> Are there any versions of JOSS still around?  I suppose I could fire
> up a PDP-10 simulator and look for a copy of AID but I was hoping for
> something less retro.
> 

Anon for this ...

The Defense Technical Information Center (DTIC) at http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/ has a lot of detailed information on JOSS. For example ... 

JOSS: ASSEMBLY LISTING OF THE SUPERVISOR
http://www.dtic.mil/docs/citations/AD0660836

I would not be surprised if JOSS could be resurrected in an emulator, if somebody felt so inclined (and I do not).

In article <6a8c02ec-86a7-42ec...@googlegroups.com>,
 <zync...@gmail.com> wrote:
>JOSS: ASSEMBLY LISTING OF THE SUPERVISOR
>http://www.dtic.mil/docs/citations/AD0660836
>
>I would not be surprised if JOSS could be resurrected in an emulator, if somebody felt so inclined (and I do not).

Huh.  I found it on the RAND web site.  It's a 170 page PDP-6
assembler listing.  It looks like it ran on the bare machine, not
under the DEC monitor.



-- 
Regards,
John Levine, jo...@iecc.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

On Thu, 03 May 2018 00:41:03 GMT, zync...@gmail.com wrote:

> On Tuesday, May 1, 2018 at 3:40:55 PM UTC-4, John Levine wrote:
>> While tidying up my bookshelf I found an old copy of
>> "Time-Shared Computer Languages" which discussed a bunch
>> of languages available on-line in 1973.
>> 
>> One of them was JOSS, first implemented on the vacuum tube Johnniac,
>> then reimplemented on the PDP-6, and available on the PDP-10 where
>> DEC called it AID.  A cut down version was available on the PDP-8 as
>> FOCAL.  I think it had a lot of influence on Basic, both in that
>> program lines were numbered and statements started with keywords like
>> Let.  The numerically inclined admired its correctly rounded ten
>> digit decimal arithmetic, so sqrt(3)*sqrt(3) was 3, not
>> 2.9999999999996. 
>> 
>> Are there any versions of JOSS still around?  I suppose I could fire
>> up a PDP-10 simulator and look for a copy of AID but I was hoping for
>> something less retro.
>> 
> 
> Anon for this ...
> 
> The Defense Technical Information Center (DTIC) at
> http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/ has a lot of detailed information on JOSS.
> For example ... 
> 
> JOSS: ASSEMBLY LISTING OF THE SUPERVISOR
> http://www.dtic.mil/docs/citations/AD0660836
> 
> I would not be surprised if JOSS could be resurrected in an emulator,
> if somebody felt so inclined (and I do not). 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JOSS

says the example shown /is/ from a modern emulator.

-- 
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.