🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <10...@pucc.Princeton.EDU> RI...@pucc.Princeton.EDU writes:
>WYLBUR's brother was ORVYL, and both originally ran under MILTEN.
>my understanding at the time was these were not acronyms, but derivative
>of the Wright family's names.  I recall hearing that ORVYL ran two
>places:  Stanford and NASA.

We used to have all of the above running on the machines at the City
University of NY.  (In fact, when I started hacking there back in high
school, they were stll running CALL-OS (BASIC on a 360 :-)  Columbia
had (has?) WYLBUR running under CMS on the 4341s.  I wrote a large part
of the help system for the local help notes in WYLBUR EXEC!  Those were
the days.

\|/ Michael L. Ardai     ar...@bu-pub.bu.edu   
--- ---------------------------------------------------------------
/|\ ...!sun!teda!maven.dnet!ardai (preferred)

In article <56...@bu.edu.bu.edu> ar...@bass.bu.edu (Michael Ardai) writes:
>In article <10...@pucc.Princeton.EDU> RI...@pucc.Princeton.EDU writes:
>>WYLBUR's brother was ORVYL, and both originally ran under MILTEN.
>>my understanding at the time was these were not acronyms, but derivative
>>of the Wright family's names.  I recall hearing that ORVYL ran two
>>places:  Stanford and NASA.
>
>We used to have all of the above running on the machines at the City
>University of NY.  (In fact, when I started hacking there back in high
>school, they were stll running CALL-OS (BASIC on a 360 :-)  Columbia
>had (has?) WYLBUR running under CMS on the 4341s.  I wrote a large part
>of the help system for the local help notes in WYLBUR EXEC!  Those were
>the days.
>

These still are the days.  It's still being run (not by my organization)
on our 3090 and some students are still subjected to it.  One of the 
comic strips in the campus newspaper even had a character called "the 
WYLBUR beast".

************************************************************************
 Lee Cox                          BITnet: H1C5962@TAMSTAR
                                  HEPnet: FNBIT::TAMHEP::THOR::H1C5962
 Asst. Systems Manager          Internet: H1C...@STAR.TAMU.EDU
 Academic Computing Services        SPAN: UTSPAN::UTADNX::THOR::H1C5962
 Texas A&M University             THEnet: THOR::H1C5962
 College Station, TX 77843-3154   GTEnet: (409)845-9577
                     Paranoia is our profession.
************************************************************************

In article <51...@helios.TAMU.EDU> h1c5962@tamunix (Lee Cox) writes:
.In article <56...@bu.edu.bu.edu> ar...@bass.bu.edu (Michael Ardai) writes:
.>In article <10...@pucc.Princeton.EDU> RI...@pucc.Princeton.EDU writes:
.>>WYLBUR's brother was ORVYL, and both originally ran under MILTEN.
.>>my understanding at the time was these were not acronyms, but derivative
.>>of the Wright family's names.  I recall hearing that ORVYL ran two
.>>places:  Stanford and NASA.
.>
.>We used to have all of the above running on the machines at the City
.>University of NY.  (In fact, when I started hacking there back in high
.>school, they were stll running CALL-OS (BASIC on a 360 :-)  Columbia
.>had (has?) WYLBUR running under CMS on the 4341s.  I wrote a large part
.>of the help system for the local help notes in WYLBUR EXEC!  Those were
.>the days.
.>
.
.These still are the days.  It's still being run (not by my organization)
.on our 3090 and some students are still subjected to it.  One of the
.comic strips in the campus newspaper even had a character called "the
.WYLBUR beast".
.
Hey, say what you will, but WYLBUR is still the best line-editor I have ever
used!  The WYLBUR EXEC language was good enough to write some pretty decent
games (our own version of ADVENT, running directely off the data-base,
comes to mind!) and other useful tools.  Writing code for WYLBUR (I.e. for
its internals) was also a delight!  Now, MILTEN I never had a chance to play
with much (beyond looking at the code) and ORVYL I never saw (but would have
loved to!).  All this was on a 360/165 running OS/MVT!  Of all CHANGE commands
I have ever used, the WYLBUR one still comes out ahead for general usefulness!
And I include the GREP-type CHANGE commands in this statement!
 
- Yossie
 
Some of the hacks we manages with WYLBUR:
1) ADVENT (like Zork), fully functional, in under 40 lines of EXEC!
2) A program to do large-typing on a tek screen (would draw the characters
   as you hit the keys as vector-characters).
3) JCL generating programs that by asking a few simple questions could produce
   100-line decks of JCL (though I loved to write the JCL myself! :-)
4) Ticking-clock on a TEK-4027 (wonderful terminal, btw, pity it was so slow
   and wound up dead!).
And so on...

In article <97...@marque.mu.edu> yos...@marque.mu.edu (Yossie Silverman) writes:
>
>Hey, say what you will, but WYLBUR is still the best line-editor I have ever
>used!  The WYLBUR EXEC language was good enough to write some pretty decent
>games...

"Doesn't sweat much for a fat kid."

--
Hal Mueller            hmue...@cssun.tamu.edu          n270ca@tamunix (Bitnet)
Graduate Student, Department of Computer Science
Research Assistant, Department of Wildlife and Fisheries Sciences
Texas A&M University, College Station, TX 77843

In article <97...@marque.mu.edu> yos...@marque.mu.edu (Yossie Silverman) writes:
>In article <51...@helios.TAMU.EDU> h1c5962@tamunix (Lee Cox) writes:
>.In article <56...@bu.edu.bu.edu> ar...@bass.bu.edu (Michael Ardai) writes:
>.>In article <10...@pucc.Princeton.EDU> RI...@pucc.Princeton.EDU writes:
>.
> ( *** much removed *** )
>
>its internals) was also a delight!  Now, MILTEN I never had a chance to play
>with much (beyond looking at the code) and ORVYL I never saw (but would have
>loved to!).  All this was on a 360/165 running OS/MVT!  Of all CHANGE commands
>I have ever used, the WYLBUR one still comes out ahead for general usefulness!
>And I include the GREP-type CHANGE commands in this statement!
> 
>- Yossie
> 
> ( *** more removed *** )
>And so on...
I did get a chance to play with MILTEN on a 370/145 under OS/MVT and it was
both fun and a pain.

I had a PL/1 interface writen by a grad student which worked like
a charm.  The computing center used to get anoyed though because my jobs
would occupy memory for a considerable period of time causing memory
fragmentation.  The idea of interacting with your job at a terminal was nearly
unheard of, we were supposed to be running batch jobs.

MILTEN also had a bad habit in that if you accepted more than one connect
request (ie. tried to service multiple terminals) and your program crashed
then MILTEN would gererate an error saying good by and die.  At that point
WYLBER would print an error saying MILTEN gone and it would die.  Then you
made yourself scarce as now all the interactive terminals were dead and users
would be milling around in some confusion.  The final complication was that
to avoid memory fragmentation, the operators would shut everything down and
reload so that MILTEN, WYLBER and YORK APL would occupy contiguous memory.

As I said a real pain.  It was only about 2 months before they changed the
access password to MILTEN and refused to tell anybody what it was.  Those
were the good old days.
-------------------------------------------------------
UUCP:  ubc-cs!van-bc!nvanbc!lawrence
MAIL:  100 13511 Commerce Parkway, Richmond, B.C., Canada, V6V 2J8
PHONE: (604) 273-4900
FAX:   (604) 273-2764

In article <10...@pucc.Princeton.EDU> RI...@pucc.Princeton.EDU writes:

>WYLBUR's brother was ORVYL, and both originally ran under MILTEN.
>my understanding at the time was these were not acronyms, but derivative
>of the Wright family's names.  I recall hearing that ORVYL ran two
>places:  Stanford and NASA.  Somewhere in my collection of cryptic
>ornaments, there is a button from Stanford that says something like
>"WYLBUR is ORVYL's Brother."

Where does ROSCOE fit in? Yet another MILTEN derivative, or is it
an independent development?

(The closest I've ever been to ROSCOE is looking at the
installation instructions and punting them off to someone with a
*real* death wish. The installation procedure at that time was
really *ugly*.)


-- 
David Boyes       |  "Where's the ka-boom? There's supposed to be an
dbo...@rice.edu   |  Earth-shattering ka-boom!...Heavens! Someone has
                  |  stolen the Illudium Q-38 Explosive Space Modulator!
"Delays, delays!" |  The Earth creature has *stolen* the Space Modulator!"

dbo...@rice.edu (David Boyes) writes:
>In article <10...@pucc.Princeton.EDU> RI...@pucc.Princeton.EDU writes:
>>WYLBUR's brother was ORVYL, and both originally ran under MILTEN.

What was MILTEN anyway? The only thing I know of it was on our old
OS/MVT system, if you typed  @UIC$DA  (supposedly to do a $DA on
the sister computer up at U of I Chicago, back would come
@UOI REQUEST NOT ACCEPTED; MILTEN NOT ACTIVE.

_____
Charley Kline, University of Illinois Computing Services
c-k...@uiuc.edu